(((POWERHOUSE SOUND))) formed in the Summer of 2005, originally with Ken Va… Read Full Bio ↴(((POWERHOUSE SOUND))) formed in the Summer of 2005, originally with Ken Vandermark on tenor sax, Ingebrigt Haker Flaten & Nate McBride on basses, Lasse Marhaug on electronics and on drums.
Ken Vandermark composed tracks with the idea of building the music from the perspective of the bass instead of the more conventional approach of composition construction, "from the top down", as he puts it. "The three major influences I considered when putting the music together were the rhythmic ideas of James Brown, the dub ideas of Lee Perry and the collage ideas of Public Enemy."
Their new Chicago-based touring line up, featuring Vandermark, McBride, Jeff Parker & John Herndon (Tortoise, Isotope 217,Exploding Star Orchestra) will continue to work from these original concepts developed at the band's inception. However, with the obvious shifts in personnel and differences in instrumentation, (((POWERHOUSE SOUND))) is undoubtedly here to test any and all genre "qualifiers" used within the independent music industry today: witness (((PHS)))'s double-cd debut, OSLO/CHICAGO: BREAKS!

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Powerhouse Sound Lyrics

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The lyrics are frequently found in the comments by searching or by filtering for lyric videos

Most interesting comments from YouTube:

Xoulrath MtG

3y↑8

@Jake Johnson MTG maybe, but FaB is already pulling stuff like this. Crucible of War, a set just released in Unlimited form in July, has already been removed from print. It became a FOMO as soon as the announcement was made, and prices spiked.

According to some in the FaB community, there aren't a ton of cards in the set that are widely needed. According to others, it was a bad move to cut the set because it has tournament staples. I don't know because I'm still learning about the game.

What I do know is that I'm currently on the fence about jumping into FaB, because even games like the WoW TCG, which had a fantastic foundation and the popularity of the biggest game around at the time, ultimately failed.

Legend Story Studios making a short print set, in Unlimited no less, of just three waves and then calling it, reeks of market manipulation. The game is 2 years old and hasn't even gained a foothold yet in my LGS. They are actively pushing it and can't get anyone to play currently. I imagine it's wallet fatigue as opposed to the game itself.

Regardless, I've been looking into FaB as well (obviously), precisely because of Magic's current business practices. But I don't want to trade the devil I know for one that I don't, and stunts like short printing a set that was just released in Unlimited, of a game that is 2 years old and still trying to gain market share, is maybe just getting a different devil.

Helena Real

After watching your well thought-out exposition of wonderful quality-of-life improvements to something so simple—and yet so essential—as the de facto booster packs for MTG, I felt something akin to nostalgia.

Once upon a time I would've thought that WotC would look at this and implement it right away. It's so obvious, isn't it? Give the players more so they're incentivized to buy packs.

Nowadays, after years of product after product, most of them closer to scams than any value, I can only shake my head and accept that there will never be changes like this.

WotC doesn't care about us players: they need to double and quadruple their earnings. No time to innovate or treat the player base OK (treating us well is a pipe dream, at this point), no: selling us less for more is the one tenet, the one belief that holds the company together.

So sad.

Sorry, Prof: great video as always. Keep them coming! Your love for MTG is contagious 😊🖤

Justin Kutch

I get the arguments you're making here, and I think that a closer to masterpiece implementation would be great! However, the List has always seemed to me like a compromised solution. Here's why:

Designing a set of reprint cards per set is a lot of work. The set designers not only needs to design the set, but they also need to know what cards need reprints (not to tough, but still something), which cards could fit the theme, coordinate with the next few set designers to not overlap reprints too much, AND get new art treatments. If it's done right, the cards are a solid injection into the secondary market. Done poorly, and the reprints overshadow the set causing the boosters to skyrocket in price as collectors chase the reprints.

However, the list is a separate pool that can be centrality managed, updated based on need, it requires no set specific theming, symbols, or anything like that. Now that is an optimization that is worth it to a company. In this system, set designers don't have to coordinate, art can be reused, and the market gets more copies, helping to control price inflation in the secondary market.

The size of the list and it's opacity makes sense too. These aspects help keep players from knowing which list cards to chase in a set. It keeps the focus on the set and ensures that players that want to collect the set can do so without prices being inflated by the chase list cards. And again, the secondary market still gets those reprints.

What I don't fully understand yet is the user of the list to reprint the mechanically unique UB cards as MtG versions. This seems counter intuitive to the other points I made. However, I could see how that might be done - announcing the card, it's addition to the list, and which sets it will be present in can still be done. And if it's going to be made available for a longer period of time, the chase impact might be lessened.

In fact, the list is elegant in that way - it doesn't stop WotC from pushing chases into a set of they want to get people excited, while being a low cost mechanism for continuous injections into the secondary market.

Now it's just a matter of tweaking the mix. How often do they include them? Which products get them? Longer list? Or cut it down to emphasis it? All can be tweaked over time.

All comments from YouTube:

Tolarian Community College

3y↑63

Go to https://BuyRaycon.com/tolariancommunity for 15% off your order! Brought to you by Raycon.

dagnje

2y↑1

raycons are fucking trash, why did you sellout for raycons?

evileyeball

I do not like sticking earbuds into my ears

Justin Patrick

Lemme find out your magnus in final fantasy 14 just met this guy talks and acts just like you

Athena, Shield of the Divine

Hey Prof, I have a question. Is this a limited time offer?

olivian george

I'll buy raycon for you Professor

Steve Peter

3y↑1.1K

“Set boosters were designed to remove draft chaff but they filled the List with draft chaff”. That is an excellent summary/critique, prof. (A retro-frame OG art delver would be fire).

Tyler Chauvet

Agree 100%, The list ended up being like iconic masters, but with more relevant reprints.

KrepsyK

@Ben Nelson It still seems you have no idea what I'm talking about. To put it simply, if you like drafting, buy sealed boxes and hold them when they're cheap so you don't pay inflated prices later when you want to draft them (and historically sealed product always increases in value/price).

Ben Nelson

@KrepsyK You don't collect with booster packs. If you're drafting you don't have the right to complain that you don't get good cards.

Edit: OH and you're also wrong. Ever hear of a cube draft? IT seems up your alley.

KrepsyK

2y↑1

@Ben Nelson you dont draft with singles.

Ben Nelson

@KrepsyK If you're buying boxes to invest, you're doing it wrong. I mean FFS, the Professor tells you to buy singles if that's what you want.

10 More Replies...

dexagos

3y↑85

The list definitely feels like something that an AI made by hitting ‘Random’ on Scryfall 300 times instead of something that was crafted with mortal hands.

alvedonaren

2y↑2

I'm pretty sure that's actually what happened.

Kane Benjamin

3y↑2

An intern probably wrote the script and they wanted to find a use for it haha

DocTwisted

2y↑21

"It would be nice if you told viewers to buy set boosters..."
"It would be nice if they were worth purchasing!"

That's it, that's the whole crux.

MrDoomaxe

3y↑62

I want to add my 2 cents. I'm a new player and I started playing buying AFR commander decks and bundles. When Innistrad came out I've decided to buy a couple of bundles just because I wanted to see wizard approach on "classic" horror. Searching online I've found out that the bundles contained set boosters instead of draft, after some researches my thought was "Oh cool, so there are some packs that are more 'opening experience' oriented and contains more valuable cards". Bought them, opened them and the result was approximatly the same amount of rares/mythic, some common foils, and 3/4 commons from "the list". I've sincerily felt bad of that pack opening... Why removing two packs only to give shitty cards and saying on your website that set boosters are more valuable.

Another problem, in my opinion, not mentioned in this video is localization. I'm an italian player, I know english, but when I've opened the packs and found out that the list was not localized even if the cards have a localized counterpart I felt like wizard don't care at all to make a well thought product and put the list in there just to fuck around with prices.

I've decided that I will never buy set boosters again and just buy drafts. Yea there are more commons and useless card but at least I can have good times with my friends

Moe

welcome to the game, as a fairly new player myself (only 8 months at this point) id reccommend to not buy any more packs / bundles unless you really want it or u just want to support your LGS, 1 piece of advice is to buy singles over packs / bundles (precons are good to buy if u like em just upgrade em with singles)

Ian O'Malley

3y↑1

i agree. i also got into MTG around AFR and bought bundle of AFR, game nights box, and Commanders Legends booster box. I will not buy set boosters. And now that WotC has changed bundles into set boosters, i will not buy bundles. To be fair, i also buy a lot more singles for my deckbuilding than draft boosters anymore regardless, so im not the kind of player who is looking for an opening experience

chevin0

3y↑512

'a great idea that has been implemented poorly'

almost every single MtG product for several years, in a nutshell

mindustrial

2y↑2

Every Magic product since introduction of The Gatewatch

Gonçalo Ferreira

3y↑2

@Alexander Aust thats the spirit of it and yet just assumptions.
when you think about it most people complain but keep playing and keep paying.
pros say nobody ever truly quits magic, they just take breaks.
most streamers/youtubers are wales that complain about mtgA´s economy but in the presentations they give very efefctive advertize the game and help create a culture of FOMO they turns negative really fast.
things are complex.

Alexander Aust

@Gonçalo Ferreira Somehow, sales from Whales makes up a lot more of their revenue than the rest of the player base. It's really frustrating, because this keeps pushing them to create products and services that are very anti-consumer, but it doesn't matter because the Whales eat it up.

Mikkel Jensen

3y↑1

Wotc companion app was shown on their products five years before release and it feels like something made in a one day gamejam, and done poorly if that point didn't come across

Grasshopper

3y↑1

Yep, exactly. Like look what they are doing to bundles now. lol so many bad decisions.

3 More Replies...

Mathew Evans

3y↑154

They did exactly with the List what I feared it would become: An additional spin on the gacha machine to trick people into buying set boosters instead of mini-masterpieces.

KrepsyK

Yup

Anton Skor

Damn, I just commented something damn near similar about the gacha, I was late by two days xD

Xoulrath MtG

3y↑8

Jake Johnson MTG

3y↑2

@Xoulrath MtG I'm pretty sure this is why flesh and blood took off?

Xoulrath MtG

3y↑14

I got them instead. After being extremely disappointed with all of the booster boxes that I've bought this year, save for MH2, I've just stopped buying boosters all together.

I've always known that it was better to buy singles, but it is fun to open packs, and it's a quick and easy way for me to support my LGS without having to spend hours combing over their available singles from each new set. But thanks to Wizards horrid business decisions, I've stopped buying boxes again.

At this point I'm just looking for another game to replace Magic entirely.

Thane Tawny Tweyman

3y↑27

This is great.

When you're already getting The List in only 1/4 of your set booster packs, they should ALWAYS be exciting - they're essentially all mythic-rares. They should feel that way.

Shrinking the list down to 50 cards gives you a reasonable chance to get any individual List card. At 300, you don't.

James Lee

3y↑12

It's been two decades since I was in meetings about product content such as this. But, everything you point out in this video demonstrates just how damaged and broken the current process inside of Wizards is. Back in our day, we would have immediately recognized the stupidity of this design and quickly fixed it long before launch.

niyr

3y↑21

Cutting the number of cards on The List to 50-75 high quality cards is a great idea. Adding in new art for each set for theme will make WOTC raise the prices of set boosters. I'd much rather just have the list be small with good, useful cards that may be thematic to each set, with some old art/borders thrown in.

Rossamund Brennan

3y↑484

Such a well presented and thoughtful argument. Find myself totally agreeing.

Donald Payton

Was in IHYD vs Posty vs Prof.

Auzweed1987

3y↑3

@Will To The Iam yes he taught English at the college level. I can’t remember what video it was, but he talked about a time some people looked him up and found him on campus to play their cube. He was flattered but also nervous about the whole situation.

User #4841

3y↑1

My experience was completely the opposite than Prof’s. I cracked like 3 boxes and 70% of my list pulls were fire. Ancient tomb, krark’s thumb, sneak attack, hermit Druid, animate dead, grand arbiter Augustus, aura shards, and that red 3 drop ritual that gives 5 red (I never remember the name)

Will To The Iam

@Collin Cervino Was he really an English teacher or is this a meme?

Collin Cervino

3y↑1

Well he is an English teacher lol

João Paulo Hengstler de Oliveira

3y↑32

"a great idea, but implemented poorly" could be an apt description of MTG in the past 3-ish years.

Grasshopper

exactly

Riley McPhee

3y↑18

Alternative idea: reprint high-demand old sets as a 'themed list' set and recommission new art either across the board or art for cards that were originally commissioned by now problematic artists

Joey_Pajamas

2y↑1

And don't make the boosters ridiculously expensive. Anything over £6 a pack is really pushing it IMO

iisfunnyman

3y↑8

Having the list be themed to the set would be amazing. I pulled a Moonmist in the same pack as an Arlinn and it felt just about as good as if I pulled some random expensive mythic off the list.

CorranHuss

3y↑7

it also feels bad having very recent cards in it. The first list had ikoria, eldrain and theros beyond death cards in it. with each of the added card came more of those recent sets. At least wait until the cards aren’t in Standard, preferably longer

cubencis

3y↑411

They could improve the list by simply adding one to every pack-- if there must be chaff then you'd expect at least this.

Centuros Productions

Wait, you mean like... in Time Spiral? Old cards in the back of your pack can't be done!

Phenax

3y↑3

@S B ofc you can but that is not as fun is it now otherwise the gold cards would be the same price as the bad ones. The game can still keep being a collectables game with a halving in average card price. So i don't really see any arguments left aside from "but wizzards of the coast need to turn big profit because I invested in them"

S B

@Phenax if you want low prices, play a board game. This is collectable. You can still play with a less expensive card, that has a correspondingly weaker effect.

androkguz

3y↑3

I agree. The idea that the List should be special seems to be the problem

The List exists besides stuff like masterpieces, special art and Strixhaven Archives. It's not themed or bound. The point of it seems to be to just reprint stuff you want there to be more of, without complications on design. Less like collector artwork and more like just vitamins.

Let there be a changing list of card that nobody fully remembers but people need. A constant injection of those. But don't sell them as if they are Masterpieces

Phenax

3y↑2

@S B Hasbro is just pure greed making MTG worse for everyone who enjoys playing it. What you are saying is just join the greedy that will solve the problem... come on you know better than this.

12 More Replies...

ReplayStation

3y↑6

At first I thought the list was going to be evocative of mystery boosters and everyone loved mystery boosters. If set boosters came with a guaranteed card from the list in every pack, that would make much more sense

PieBandit

3y↑56

You missed an easy improvement Prof. If they're going to leave a lot of the chaff on the list, they could put one in each set booster, not just 1/4 of them

Darkflame94

3y↑3

1/8 after New Cappena comes out, as Blake revealed on the weekly stream that New Cappena will be the set that has the alternative versions of the Stranger Things, and the rate will be 1/8 packs have a random non ST card from the list, 1/8 will have the stranger things cards specifically (so the other cards on the list basically doubled in rarity).

returningwhisper

3y↑22

The List having filler cards really discourages me from ever wanting to buy set booster packs.

James Gratz

Just buy singles

Grasshopper

it's a trap, don't buy it. Collector boosters or bust.

Jake Stromberg

3y↑4

Sometimes you get things right, this would be one of those times. We can only hope that someone at WotC actually hears the communities cry on this one and gives us what we want

Andrew Moffitt

3y↑15

I've got a new drinking game: take a shot every time the Professor says something reasonable that would positively impact Magic and its community of players and retailers.

Maybe you'd better call the ambulance ahead of time, just to be on the safe side.

Amber West

2y↑1

lol, that's a dangerous game ;p

themadstudent

3y↑8

Sorry Prof, your first mistake was taking WotC at their word about what their goals were. The confounding factor that you didn't touch on is "reprint equity" and WotC is VERY conservative in how much of that they spend on reprint sets. I think the reason there are so many complete dud and draft chaff cards on The List is because the suits were only willing to allow a specific (if arbitrary) value for that "The List" booster pack slot. In order to have actually in demand cards on the list, they had to pad it out with complete trash to bring the average down.

However even if this analysis I've given is exactly correct, this leads to an interesting dial WotC can turn for "power-down" standard sets. Since weak power level sets are always and will always be unpopular, they could crank up the average value of the "The List" slot to compensate, maintaining the overall value of the pack while giving standard it's lame sets.

Voyager1

3y↑10

I wish the Prof was in every WotC board meeting. Even if his ideas only made it through 10% of the time, the game would be better for it. And for the 90% of the time his council fell on deaf ears, I’d be happy just knowing he’d be standing in the corner, arms folded, shaking his head violently.

Voyager1

3y↑2

@Finlay Jones I appreciate the correction, man. Bet you weren’t expecting that, huh? 😄

Finlay Jones

3y↑2

Counsel. I feel like it's OK to do this because we're on a Prof's channel.

TeamDreamhunter

3y↑4

Honestly I forgot The List existed. It's such an underwhelming thing that I simply haven't thought about it in ages. Absolutely fantastic ideas as always, Professor.

John Dolan

3y↑14

My two cents: something like Strixhavens “Mystical Archive” subset would work great for what prof is suggesting

thebrbninja

3y↑5

I really like your suggestions. It rarely feels special to get a list card because most of the time when you get one, it's some worthless card I couldn't trade even if I wanted to.

david jones

3y↑59

Similarly, I feel ‘The List’ is wasted opportunity for new and experienced players alike to build their collection of potentially playable cards outside of the current standard environment. These cards could be used in commander or as a way to help get a newer player into an eternal format. A steady drip of playable “old” cards would do wonders for the overall MTG environment. I feel that the Mystical Archive cards in Strixhaven was a positive example of how this can be done. 25-30 reprint cards per standard set with “archival art” would be plenty. Only available in set boosters, not drafts.

The List cards are too watered down and unfocused (especially considering the rate at which they appear in set boosters) to make them chase-worthy for an average player.

Blend the execution of Mystical Archive and “The List” and that might be a winning formula.

NoEsUnYoutuber

@Null for None On the other hand, Lightning Bolts from more recent printings sell for less than two dollars. Obviously WOTC can't make products that are more valuable for resale than they are in-store (although since they don't make money off secondary market sales I don't see why not, beyond potentially offending the resalers who field Pro Tour teams), but you'd hope for a rare specialty item they could include things a bit more exciting than a two dollar common. If you're making a product that serves to get people into an eternal format, you're not selling to the purely casual players anymore - reprint some of the good stuff that's actually expensive and keeps people out of the format! Why not throw in some Goblin Guides if you want to rope in those Burn players? At very least, don't reprint cards that are super common - back when I was still playing a lot of paper magic, I ended up with at least a few bolts and I never once played Burn at an event or anywhere else.

Null for None

3y↑1

The idea of a new player buying set boosters and slowly getting a playset of lightning bolts would be cool if they were to put "old" but decent cards in the list

Lorient

3y↑2

Agree with this completely. In fact, I ended up buying a booster box of Strixhaven specifically because I wanted the mystical archive cards. I love alternate art/bordered cards and those are normally enough to get me to invest in product. The list is kinda the opposite of that.

The Big Bad Wolf

3y↑2

I'm coming from the perspective of someone who has played for a looong time, but just recently started buying actual products. I had two or three old decks I just ran casually against people, but since starting my own commander circle (sadly a very small one at this point) I've started actually collecting more cards. I found the Mystical Archive to be an amazing concept and so I bought a box of Strixhaven. I didn't even regret it after opening it! If these "Mystical Archive" things would appear in future packs I would love it. They could even be themed around the cards in standard. For example Innistrad could have featured reprints of old classics from the OG Innistrad and Shadows over Innistrad blocks. That would be amazing for us coming in late into the hobby. I'd def buy more boxes atleast!

Rosetta Foster

3y↑6

The "cards being presented in their original frame concept" isn't something I mind, per se, but it worked a lot better in the Mystery Booster set because of the theming of it being a Chaos/Cube draft in a booster pack. That said, as cool as set themed List Cards would be, I doubt it'll ever happen because it's more cost (they'd need to commission a new artist for every set that List card appears in) when the List seems like it's supposed to be an inexpensive way to get reprints out there.

Danny Irvin

3y↑205

I feel like how they did the mystical archive cards from strixhaven, would have been perfect for the list

Conlan McGuff

3y↑3

Exactly, quality over quantity please.

Zachariah Poltergeist

3y↑10

I wish they would just continue the MA and ditch the List.

Mathew Evans

3y↑42

The Mystic Archive was the List done (mostly) right. A small curated group of cards with at least 1 card from it appearing in every pack. Cards had unique alt art and were thematic to the setting being some of the more evocative and well known spells from across the multiverse. The fact they did this so easily puts paid to the lie that they can't do it for the List.

Zack Larez

2y↑2

As a relatively new Magic player, I like the list. At first, when I was only playing standard, I hated them. "Why is there a random old card in my pack?" But now, after playing Commander for awhile, I really enjoy them. Even if they're not crazy powerful cards, they help me rethink what kind of mechanics I can try to run in my deck, and better, they often wind up adding a fun mechanic to my deck that effects not only me but often other players.

Nich Miller

3y↑6

The only cards from The List that have even been remotely "cool" to me are the Future Sight shifted cards. Worthless but neat.

KingSTARwolf

3y↑5

Just my two cents after having opened over a dozen set boxes since they started this thing. I've only ever opened 3 relevant list cards. A Monastery Mentor, an AEther Vial, and a Hermit Druid. Literally every other list card I've opened has been junk or worthless. It feels like they are intentionally limiting the relevant card's pull rates as to not tank the values and upsell you on the chance. Also, as of Innistrad: Midnight Hunt, the set boosters I opened contained a lot of duplicate rares and mythics. Along with several packs containing multiples of the same commons and uncommons in a row in the pack.
They really don't feel like they're worth it at all. Maybe if they were the same price as a draft box, but it's Wizards. That ain't happening.

technole

3y↑7

The wizards economists in the ivory tower won’t approve one set card in each pack, since there that single digit percentage of getting 4 rares/mythics per pack, and a fifth would make their heads explode.

Helices

3y↑1

Thank you for this wonderful and passionate discussion. I was very wary to begin playing Magic, from the outside it looked like just brainless nerds and expensive paper but I was so quickly shown otherwise. Your vigor for the quality of the game and it's products is very reassuring. Here's to hoping WotC can add some value and clarity to the List's features.

pokeslob

3y↑2

While I definitely agree that the list is too big and too random, I strongly disagree about your third point. With the amount of special treatments and new artwork we see in things like booster fun, collector boosters, master pieces, secret layers, etc. I actually like having just a regular looking magic card in my pack. Also, I honestly think the little reprint stamp is purposefully boring: if the intention is to reprint cards to bring their values down, then printing lower value versions of the cards is the best route, I think. (I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think masterpieces brought the value of any cards down significantly? Nor have secret layers.)

June Pyle

Love coming back to this when they've implemented a lot of these changes for Streets of New Capenna! 67 rares/mythics (less if you exclude stranger things reprints) with a thematic tie to the set! Really nice to see such a great move by WotC.

lsn11

3y↑2

To be honest, I regularly forget The List exists until I'm reminded of it like I was with this video. I guess that supports everything you said on the current state of The List quite well.

Steven Moncivais

3y↑1

To be perfectly honest, this is the very first I've heard of The List. Maybe I don't follow MtG as diligently as most planeswalkers do, but the idea of older cards with planes specific art work (and maybe borderless cards, too,) sounds really sweet! I will need to research some about this List but if it's as problematic as you suggest, then maybe I should steer clear of it until WotC gets it's collective head out its ass and rectifies it.

Mike v

3y↑1

List pulls can definitely make for an exciting opening, I was lucky enough to get an Emrakul, Thrumming Stone, and a Primal Vigor in that slot.

Angelo Johnson

3y↑2

A big part missed is cube. Snubhorn sentry is great in limited and I literally just ordered a Nightshade Peddler because I was already using my copy and my LGS didn’t have one (turns out it goes great with Halana, Kessig Ranger or really any commander with first/double strike).
I agree they are not all for me as I do not have a cube (I know, I know) but the list is not just for commander

dsdragonspawn

3y↑1

I would love to see them implement something like this for Kamigawa Neon Dynasty where they do 75 old Kamigawa staples

Xalyn937

3y↑126

Man you are pumping out the quality content!

way_of_ dao

as a newbie i would love the list to reperesent the nostalgic times that it was for the players back in the days. to me it sounds like this isnt the case right now, based on the aspects that were explained. as i understand it, the list was supposed to bring nostalgia to the modern game carried by one or another beloved reprint.

Eddy Santana

3y↑2

Although I agree the List is pretty crappy, what I am getting from the video is a request to replace the list with a mystical archive type product each set. which goes back to an old wotc idea of each set would have masterpieces. then next thing we know that's where were at, no more list, back to masterpieces with higher rarities, likely higher price and it will be complained about. I would just chop the # of cards on the list in half, removing commons and anything valued under $1, have no versions of cards printed within the last 2-3 years and increase the frequency they appear in packs to maybe 1 out of 3 packs.

Iffy Wizardry

3y↑1

If I were an exec at Wizards, I would just implement pretty much every suggestion the Professor offered up for free like this. Then I’d just watch the money roll in. The List would be so much more of a factor with these changes.

Andy Goody

3y↑1

IMO the goal of the list should be to drive down secondary market prices for staples. If Wizards officially sanctions formats with expensive staples then they need to ensure some version of that card isn't cost prohibitive.

NoRealPattern

Glad someone is talking about this! I was excited about the list at first, but my experience with opening set boosters has taught me not to be. As others have said it should either be the currently list with one in each pack or only good cards in a similar frequency.

Hien Nguyen

Just echoing everyone else: good idea, poor execution. When I first heard of The List, I got so excited. Finally, a steady stream of reprints. Then when the entire list was published, I went through it and thought, "wait, what? Why is this on the list?"

CottonCandy Samurai

I actually like the idea of the list being themed and as a "set" within the current set. I would definitely be more tempted to by a box

Someone

3y↑11

"Legally not gambling."
That's the theme, face it.

Bryce Johnson

Thank you, Professor, for doing WotC's strategy and marketing for them. The List cards in retro or cohesive set art would do so incredibly well.

Matt Dolan

3y↑1

I'd love to see The List improved. You have some great points. Thank you as always. I'm just not sure my wallet can afford the corrections to the list. WotC has those good margins to be concerned about.

Lance

I’d like to see the list added to Arena so the cards can be used in friendly matches at least. Kind of like how some of the Mystical Archive cards can only be used in friendly matches.

Michael Filosa

I would love it if “The List” included a group of cards from previous sets in the same plane. As of now, I’ve only ever seen garbage pulled from packs. Usually disappointing.

777CrimsonChaos

Thank you for voicing pretty much all my gripes with set boosters as they currently are. I was just talking with people about how I was feeling tired of them because they didn’t really have the impact they were meant to. Multiple rares happens infrequently and isn’t all that impressive when the majority of rares and mythics in standard sets are basically bulk. And everything I felt wrong with the list as it is was voiced here. You’re paying around an extra dollar a pack and most times it feels almost more disappointing than opening a regular draft pack. That should be a big red flag right there. But I like the suggestions made here, I think they would definitely give set boosters more oomph.

KorKy_CCG

I've opened around 30 different set booster box's and 90% of the time I was bitterly disappointed with list pulls. Only a couple of those were actual home run box's as far as the list was concerned, the best being a Kaldheim set box which had wrenn and six, emrakul and a godsire. But totally agree great concept just needs a bit of tuning 👍

Place holder name

I personally really like the list, I’m new to mtg so it’s fun opening an old card out of a pack and seeing the card formatting of a bygone era and also getting to have a refreshing break from the same theme I’m opening constantly from the same set.

Ethan States

For me, I’ve just taken set boosters as the possibility of getting more than one rare per pack. I’ve more or less discounted the concept of the list and if I get one, woo. But the best one I’ve even pulled was a morophon most recently. Everything else from the list I’ve pulled has always been chaff, and I’ve just largely ignored them.

Choris

3y↑166

As someone relatively new to MTG, I was pretty excited by the idea of the list. I would get to experience some of Magic's history. However, after opening some boxes, the list cards were by far the least exciting part of the openings. I started really excited every time I noticed there would be a list card, but in the end, uncommon showcases from the set were far more exciting. I like the idea of the list, but it's so bloated that it just feels not at all noteworthy. At least if they had cool treatments, I could feel like they could be worth throwing in a binder. Right now, they're all just in a box with the rest of my bulk.

Brian Graham

3y↑2

I’ve opened 3-4 set booster boxes and only found 1 card on the list that had any value, and none I actually wanted to play. As it is I don’t even consider it when buying a booster box. There’s got to be a better way to do it.

Georgio Papakonstantinou

3y↑4

Agree with all of these points, I thought they would act as lottery cards with rares/mythical only but getting some bulk common I pulled a few years ago is such a feel bad. Only pull that was worth was a Cavern

KastronVie

I was excited by the list, until I opened a set booster and realised there wasn't a list card in every pack. That along with most of the cards being random commons really made it uninteresting to me. I did lose to Runed Stalactite being randomly relevant in a set booster pack war, that was neat I guess

Tate Ledford

3y↑1

I managed to pull a Scroll Rack out of a Commander Legends booster that I randomly picked up at Target one day. That felt so awesome! I feel like pulls like that out of boosters are too few and far between

Nothing To See Here

Would be amazing if they had used the list to do something alternative with the storyline. Something like Ixilan Vampires in Innistrad, mix in some reprints from original Innistrad, such as Huntmaster of the Fells or Champion of the Parish.

transgirl420

Great video, thank you for sharing!
I agree with everything you said, I think it's so frustrating that there's only one list card in 4 packs AND most of the list cards are extremely underwhelming. The way it is now, when I see that I'm getting a list card (because of the magic back instead of token*), I get excited, but then it turns out to be a random bad common, so it's extra disappointing. It should at least be one or the other, like if most of them are bad, just have them in every pack at least instead of the token. But I think your idea of having it be themed based on the set, with at least something cool like new art, or old border, to make it at least a little interesting.

*With Midnight Hunt, sometimes it's just a DFC checklist card, which is also pretty disappointing. And now that I'm thinking about it, if set boosters aren't for draft, couldn't they just not include the checklist cards?

Antonio Atayde

Such a great idea! I would love to buy set busters If the list were on one of those treatments. MEMORABLE its the word the list needs.

J.R. 17

I agree. I would’ve enjoyed seeing All Hallows’ eve reprinted with this newest set

Brian Graham

As something a bit off the wall, maybe the list should include all the cards for an additional commander precon for each set. This would make sure it included some valuable cards from the past, and would get people opening more set boxes to complete it. A list card in each booster would mean people would need to open 2-3 boxes to get a complete one, if you don’t include lands.

Christina Morris

I'd definitely be a lot more interested in picking up Set Boosters if the List had alternate art/frame treatments. As it is if I'm going to buy a box (which I don't do all that often), it's always going to be draft or something like Jump/Start, since the main reason to buy packs for me otherwise is to play. But alternate treatments could really make Set Boosters a lot more attractive!

jordan vanbesien

as someone who started collecting recently. This is actually something I looked at and realized after watching people opening boxes after boxes.
this suggestion would really feel nice specially if I open one of the list cards. I really feel bad when i get a pack and it just feels worthless.

Tom Jones

I got into Magic in the 90’s primarily because I loved collecting. I play more now than collect, but I love the alt-art cards. I LOVE the idea of “the list” having set themed art versions!

xXSoralinkXx

3y↑1

Hmmmm... To a certain degree I agree, because the list really feels a bit forgettable and promiscuous, but to me that is also part of the fun. Nobody is supposed to keep track on the list, I guess, because it is a lot more enjoyable to find something unexpected in a pack. I really like to see old cards with the original frame, art, and set symbol. And I enjoy opening weird cards that I have never even noticed before. I agree that it would be nice to have a higher ratio of valuable cards on the list, but personally I would not enjoy new art, or any special treatment for those cards. That's what masterpieces and/or showcase cards are good for. But the list is like a time machine, and I feel like that is how it was intended to be, and I like it.

mdchiesi

You have good points about the size and changes, and your ideas are pretty good. Overall I like how WOTC has recognized the secondary markets and is adding cards into the list. The "good cards" are really hard to try to get so at least I'm glad there are more on other markets

Robin

I'm a new player so I like the old chaff for my collection, but if they keep it they should make a list card guaranteed to be in every set booster. Right now set boosters are often not worth it over draft boosters.

MrFarche

I am so happy Prof put out this vid. I felt the very same way, I thought the list was supposed to be an outlet for decent reprints. I have really only remembered draft chaff in those slots...

Nathan R

Playing devil's advocist I think the one redeeming quality is new players getting the experience of opening older cards. Being a player who started at Theros Beyond Death I think it can be fun to open a card that I would have never gotten the chance to open. But I definitely think the list needs improvement.

Tonz of Fun

I'm okay with getting a waste land because I have friends that are looking for them. I do agree with with every other point here. I think an Innistrad themed Waste land would be amazing.

Infekted

I remember pulling open a List Cavern of Souls. It was a great pull for me, but I can see your points. Keep up the analysis videos!

M Schwede

Going back through the videos I haven't watched in full, this really is a strong one that I somehow overlooked!

A very very good in-depth quality opinion on fixing, nay, improving the game's core issue. 🤙🏻

WeedWarrior

3y↑2

You're totally correct. The list was supposed to help, not be a part of the problem. It just needs fixing, maybe one in every 2 packs has a list card...?

William Bly

I have had some good luck with the List so far since it came out. However, I agree with all your points! It would be nice to have a smaller list that you could be able to actually collect reasonably.

Helena Real

Amber West

I love this video! This is the best review and viewpoint on the List yet. I would love to see special treatments to List cards, heck yea!

Lord Of Garbage Progenitor Of Trash

The feeling of opening a snapcaster mage while your buddy opens an air elemental is certainly some type of feeling

Justin Kutch

MTG Unpacked

I didn't know Snapcaster Mage was on the list until I pulled one. Definitely way more exciting than pulling yet another common or land!

polar official

if there was something worh while in the set, i would guaranteed buy more sealed of it. thats why i liked strixhaven so much, i thought the mystical archives was awesome! if something along those lines became more regular that would be incredible

Adrian J

I really like set boosters,and yes all your ideas would make it awesome opening packs but make chase cards more expensive. It's a give and take that i would like to see happen

Irvin Yeager

Had a friend crack a set booster as prize support from a prerelease after being gone from magic for 5-6 years. He went and pulled draft chaff from the "List" and was really unimpressed. A missed opportunity for sure. I really don't appreciate the art insert and would prefer another card especially when the pack ends up being worse than a regular booster for the count of playable cards.

Hitsujikai

Exactly how I feel. On one hand, I pulled Doubling Cube and Herald's Horn from my AFR set box and was thrilled. On the other, I only pulled things like Runed Stalactite and Venerated Teacher (< $0.10 cards) in my MID set box. That AFR box felt super satisfying as a result, and the MID box was a bit more of a letdown. I'd love a more focused List for each set, that would 100 % make buying the boxes feel more worthwhile.

Steven Satak

This episode is actually informative, goes beyond mere opinion and has high production values. Good work.

Eric Salazar

The list can have a secondary feature of subsidizing standard sets keeping financial value of packs without power creep in standard or modern.

Thannak V

3y↑2

Ha! I got a Trecherous Werewolf out of a box.

First thought: “Oh, cool! Perfectly on theme! This should go great in one of the Commander decks I’m gonna build out of this!”

Second thought: “…am I missing something here?”

Third thought: “Huh. Someone in charge must just really like the art. Guess I can’t complain too much, I’d throw Glissa Sunseeker’s worthless arse into every set.”

KrepsyK

I've pulled 3 Frost Titans and 1 Sun Titan and neither of those cards are worth more than 2 bucks. It's hard to be excited about those cards when they could have been Tomb of Yawgmoth or Cavern of Souls...

Karl Smink

If you reprint list cards with a new art every set, the average price of the card isn't going to go down very much.
We've seen this with cards that get visual updates and overhauls.
All the individual ideas presented here are good, but some conflict with each other / the goals expressed.

daedalin

There are very few feelings in Magic more disappointing than seeing you got a List card in your booster while flipping through only to realize it's a Selesnya Keyrune or Goblin Lore. Which, incidentally, are the only two list cards I've pulled in the probably two dozen set boosters I've opened so far.

Jacob Buck

In the beginning I was kind of excited for the list and I cracked a few pricey cards but sooooo few and far between that I quickly lost care in hoping for list cards in set booster packs. Your improvement to the list would make such a difference. And if they don't want to do this and stick with the mostly garbage cards and not improve on anything at all.....They could at the VERY LEAST add a list card to every pack then.

Jesse Kincaid

I came back to magic and bought my first set booster with Strixhaven because the theme and narrative drew me in. The art and style of Khaldheim convinced me that set boosters were the way to go. The concept of set boosters is GREAT but as with almost all things WOTC, that great idea quickly got crippled in the endless quest for a new financial high. The company seems to be forever stuck in this cycle of finding ways to ensure that they get their money and the only thing they haven't ever been willing to try is making a product that's genuinely worth the out of pocket expense at every level, (face/shelf value, collector value, play value) I wanted my Strixhaven set booster box to inspire me to pick up another one to see what I would get, but the fact is it still feels like their first and only concern is getting my money for as little effort as possible, which does nothing to make me brand loyal, and that's the ultimate crime because their actual themes and stories and art design seem to get better and better but their product distributions end up feeling worse and worse.

Gauthier Philippe

thank you for your insight on the subject, as always. It finally put words on why i was never interested in buying set booster packs

Robert Blankenship

On the flip side, reprinting the old cards over and over with the same art and even with the same set symbol just makes the originals feel "un-special". Wizards should never be reprinting cards with the same set symbol, that's just crazy to me. So I wasn't particularly happy about The List. But reprints with new art (especially if it is thematic) would be legit.

Reaper

I was really disappointed opening my set booster boxes when all I found were commons. Not kidding, not one single uncommon. The list is sad and it needs to be changed. You are always right on point prof. 👉keep it up.

ztykowork

I agree, if they want the product to stick they have to grant it a special feel, that unique something only provided by a list card, even if it would be a special border, alternate art, etc (also cutting out draft clutter).

Fillmore

3y↑51

You're right on Prof. The list is a failure. IMO - the rarity of the good hits, the inclusion of BS commons from the previous sets (so weird). I absolutely LOVE the idea of the list but the implementation as you said is flawed. It needs to feel impactful when you hit one, and right now, seeing an Eldraine common... The List needs a revamp. I really hope WOTC watches this video :)

Jason Riha

3y↑1

I remember pulling common AFR cards in my recent set boosters and was livid. I don't care if it was a werewolf and thematic. Telling me there wasn't any other innistrad card to put in instead?