Well here we are with another gem of a jam dredged from the murky past of t… Read Full Bio ↴Well here we are with another gem of a jam dredged from the murky past of the Connecticut "New Wave“ (as they called it then; either that or “punk rock“) scene. Reflex From Pain can be viewed as the missing link between Violent Children, 76% Uncertain, Youth Of Today and Shelter. Reflex From Pain existed concurrently with Violent Children. Ray drummed for V.C. and tried out singing for the first time in Reflex From Pain (“Peer Pressure” is, in fact, a V.C. song). The instrumental part from Reflex From Pain came from a variety of lesser known bands and shortly after Reflex From Pain formed the nucleus of 76% Uncertain (“Knife In My Back”, “You’re The Hate” and “Someone’s Waiting” all made the translation from Reflex From Pain to 76% Uncertain). When Ray decided to record the first Shelter 12”, it was this line up of Reflex From Pain that became Shelter (with the addition of Tom Capone). Not only that, out Jeff R. remained to produce! So there you have it, the historical context of these recordings.

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Bullshit Straight Edge
Reflex From Pain Lyrics

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Most interesting comment from YouTube:

@nealgold8442

35w↑8

Like I said in your short video, I’m a die hard P365 fan. I carry appendix in a small leather holster. I was hoping for a great review, not a so so review, because I really wanted an excuse to buy one.

My concern w/the FN was carrying appendix with a single action hammer fired gun w/o a safety.

Seems you have that concern with the P365. That being said, I would love to see a comparison between the FN & the P365 and if possible address this issue with both guns.

Your thoughts if the gun would be a candidate for a thumb safety.

As always, great video and very informative.

All comments from YouTube:

@DeanCalaway

35w↑182

The more offers, the better, I love when companies have to compete with each other for our money.

@brandonm.4187

35w↑16

Wish the government had to do that too

@Irfan87

35w↑6

Exactly. Ive never understood being too loyal to one brand. We the customer should want companies to compete as much as possible. So we get a better product and a better deal.

@BenfromFlux

35w↑8

And that is free market capitalism. Competition drives innovation and improvement.

@TRIIGGAVELLI

35w

You don't have enough 9mm purse guns already?

@crappy60

35w↑2

The beauty of capitalism

1 More Replies...

@entropicdoom8018

35w↑226

I appreciate your honest reviews. Many guntubers out there give glowing reviews to everything they get in there hands.

@AverageGIJoeOutdoors

35w↑8

true story..... It's like the Echelon.... people are raving over it.... and mags are literally falling apart.

@mikethekidd_

35w↑5

@@AverageGIJoeOutdoors to be fair, the mag issue is an easy fix and isnt the guns fault

@AA-lu7qw

35w↑6

@@AverageGIJoeOutdoors The mags are falling apart due to the user incorrectly installing the plus 3 extensions.

@FortniteDad12

35w↑2

Very true but dudes wrong about the echelon sometimes companies do have bangers

@Osprey1994

35w↑1

@@AverageGIJoeOutdoorsOk...not sure how you can eatch HO explain why that's a potential problem, and then act like it's a terrible issue.

The HS Produkt Echelon is a functionally great gun, but they need to redesign a piece of plastic that covers the bottom of the magazine (something that some people will replace anyway). It's not a knock against the gun in the slightest.

I'm saying this as someone who does not like Springfield, actively recommends people avoid them.

13 More Replies...

@criticalmemetheory5404

35w↑104

How in the world did this particular firearm pass its factory accuracy test? I was pretty stoked about this one, but not so much anymore. Thanks for the unbiased review.

@HWG-wm8ld

35w↑4

They don’t test for accuracy.

@adub1300

35w↑1

You’re assuming FN performs that test. A quick look at any 509 or reflex video will prove that they do not.

@Dustycheerio47

34w

My buddy’s 509 tac had a squib load in the first day of shooting it

@pewpew9193

34w↑8

@@foxkkkt1237That was nothing to do with the gun.

@timothypadilla4192

34w↑11

I'd say watch Hickock45 shoot the Reflex. Maybe it's the shooter?

5 More Replies...

@bryanleblanc3048

35w↑25

I’ve had this firearm about 6 weeks now, put about 350 rods through it and also allowed the employees at the local gun store to try it out, everyone liked it, because we know it’s a CCW, and it’s great for that, conceals well, carries comfortably, and less snappy than Hellcat or P365; it’s also very easy to take down and field strip. If I wanted to shoot 50 yards with 4” groups, this ain’t the pistol in buying, but if I want to pull and put rounds into an attacker 10 yards away in a quick fashion, this or a Shield Plus is 100% what I want. I’ve never had an issue with accuracy when I was honest with its designed intentions.

@johnherrera4806

29w

Well said …

@malcolmplatt3768

27w

That is a great way to frame that narrative, "honest with its designed intentions". The only intent I have with using this weapon is to do exactly what you said, draw quickly and shoot accurately and rapidly at a 10 (3-15 too) yard target. 🍻

@brokespoke4789

35w↑60

Bought one of the non optic versions for my wife a couple weeks ago. We both really like it. Put 200 rds thru it between us. No failures and it was accurate at the distance of 15 yards we were shooting at. It shot point of aim for both of us.

@Illness.og.

35w

Would you say it’s more snappy then a S&W m&p shield?

@brokespoke4789

35w

IMO about the same@@Illness.og.

@norbertotirado819

35w

Which Batch do you have? Mines is "9 thousands" and have that bad accuracy. I have the MRD Version

@brokespoke4789

34w

ours is in the upper 9k range. Non optic cut. @@norbertotirado819

@captainamer71

33w

@@Illness.og.nope

2 More Replies...

@AllAboutSurvival

35w↑11

Thanks for sharing your first shots and impressions – definitely piqued my interest in this new addition! Keep up the great work, looking forward to more reviews like this.

@chesterjohnson8290

35w↑72

Looking forward to the 1000 round review. Side by side with the Shield, P365, Hellcat & Canik would be welcome!

@jaybowen2235

35w↑8

and IWI Masada slim

@DevDog67

35w

If you're referring to a size comparison - type "handgun hero" into your search engine.

@tranquilmind8487

35w↑1

@@jaybowen2235 masada slim doesnt have picatinny

@jaybowen2235

35w↑1

and CZ CZ P01 or P07

@stevenhaynes795

29w

@jaybowen2235 maybe the cz p10s . But the p01 and p07 are not micro compact

@msab930

35w↑4

Love your analysis and honesty! Great show. I own a FN503 which I bought after shooting Glocks and Sig P365. I love my 503 for it’s small footprint and conceal-ability however the 503 only holds 6 standard and 8 with extended mag. But you are correct both have long trigger pulls. The new version has a higher capacity mag which is nice as well as a rail for accessories and red dot which the 503 doesn’t have. Grips are similar. Looks like it could be a nice option.

@thewalkindude7716

21w↑2

I've had 3 Reflexes (Long story) and all of them had problems. I bought it to replace my G43. I love the FN grip, I love the sights, and the trigger is pretty good from the factory. All of them had failure to feed problems. One would have a soft strike about every 3rd round. We tried 5 different types of ammo and 9 different magazines. We put about 200 rounds through each gun. All of them would shoot low left no matter who was shooting it. I put Holosun 507k red dots on 2 of them and I had the elevation up maxed out and it still wouldn't bring the POI up to POA. I put a laser bore sight cartridge in them and it would not line up with the iron sights. It showed low left on all of them. The same laser bore sight lined up perfectly in all of my other handguns. I sold 2 of them and the 3rd one has been at FN since September for repair, in hopes that I can at least have one good one. That was 3 months ago and it's still not fixed.

@latigomorgan

35w↑1

I'd like to see a side by side comparison with the Keltec P11, which is also a hammer-fired compact. It also has a mile long trigger pull. I'm not too crazy about it, but my daughter loves it. Nice thing about the Keltec is you can use high cap S&W 5906 mags in it.

@stainedskin123456789

35w↑76

I'll be looking forward to the inevitable follow-up review. Seems like this gun has potential, just needs a bit of polishing. I agree, though; it should be polished from the factory.

@johnelder7449

35w↑5

I love your videos; they live up to your name. When something goes wrong, both you and us(the viewers)no that the problem is not you. It's always the gun and your sense of humor is the best. Laughed my ass off on this one. Thanks for a most enjoyable video and I sincerely mean that

@bosschefrob

35w↑4

I have a 503 and it shoot really nice (besides a round falling out when you chamber and reload the round). I wonder if they were trying to make a budget friendly version with this gun.

@bearkawiboy6246

31w↑2

Just picked one up and the example I purchased has a phenomenal trigger, with the pull weight being good and the rest being short! It’s better than my 365 and only comparable to the Hellcat I have.

@chrissalazar4143

35w↑7

Yeah, it was just plain bad that "The World's Most Battle-Proven Firearms" came with a crooked rear sight. Overall though, I think on the later review you're gonna enjoy the heck out of it with the dot. Much more precise aiming. The EPS carry will direct mount to the slide without a mount, it shares the same 4/507k footprint if that may help any. Tactical Development's pro ledge with a Tlr7-sub Glock is already made for the FN Reflex too. Good review, even with the bad. Cheers.

@MultiPurposeReviewer

35w↑3

I would be mildly tempted. I'm generally a big fan of FN's pistols, and I imagine I would like this. At the same time, I already carry one of their full size pistols, and I also have a P365 for when I need something smaller, so I don't really need a micro 9 from FN just for the sake of having another FN pistol. I would absolutely be down to try it out if my range picks one up for rental.

On an unrelated note, I love Mrs. Outlaw's nails in this video. I'm not usually a fan of lime green anything, but that Skittle green looks really nice.

@teages078

34w↑3

I had this same exact issue with my late model p365. Ultimately why I sold it. I can deal with windage, however the elevation issue was a mystery. I still want to give this reflex an opportunity, hopefully you just got a Monday gun. Other channels seemed to have great luck with it.

@Ghille-Suit-Domeshot

31w

With some iron sight designs you need to put the front sight post on the point of impact like a red dot. Not right below of your intended target.

@IHADANERROR

35w↑43

The FN Reflex should come with two sets of screws - 2 pan head and 2 flat head. This is on page 40 of the owner's manual.
It is set up only for optics that take the Shield RMSc footprint: Holosun 407/507k, Romeo Zero, Swampfox Sentinel, etc.
There are no plates because you are supposed to mount it directly to the slide.

@captainamer71

33w↑2

Mine did

@scottbeal7068

35w↑3

Out of the box, my Reflex shot 2" low at 10 yards when I aligned my sights correctly. Drift seemed fine. I've adjusted my sight picture. With 400 factory rounds thru it, reliability has been perfect. Compared to my Glock 43, it seems slightly less snappy, especially with a full mag. The trigger seemed to get better as I shot. If it is possible to have a too-light trigger in a carry pistol with no manual safety, then maybe this one does. I use a plastic holster that covers the trigger guard completely when I pocket carry. I need a lot more rounds downrange before I trust this pistol. But, so far, the light is green. Is it any better than my 43 or any other similar 9mm micro? Probably not. Bill Wilson and Ken Hackathorn seemed to like the internal hammer design, they said. How about the "Weened baby's-first-pooh" yellow color? I bought a black one.

@esco7500

32w

Update? Looking to purchase my first firearm and conflicted on what to purchase.

@stevenhaynes795

29w

Try out a bersa bp9cc . It has a 3.2 lb trigger. I've had one for years and still won't carry it. But it's fun at the range.

@rudydedogg6505

35w↑7

Chris, I bought a Reflex about a month ago, took it to the range and put 100 rounds through it and it grouped low and slightly left. I put up a new target at 21 feet and really concentrated. My five-shot group was 3 1/2" low and 3/4" left. I took a picture of the target, gave the group distance from center and stated that Federal HST 124 grain had been used. I returned the pistol to FN the next day requesting a shorter front sight and windage adjustment. To their credit, FN returned the pistol in just four days. However, they made zero changes to my pistol but included a range target with five shots grouped tightly around the center using the same 124 grain ammo and fired from the same distance. There was a brief comment written on the target stating, "POA, POI".
After seeing you and your wife getting pretty much the same results, I will get back in touch with them. FN apparently wants me to adapt to their set up whereas I want the sights configured to the way that I shoot. Considering that many firearms of all types come with adjustable sights, I don't think I am being unreasonable and other than the sights, I like the gun. I also have an FN FNS-40C that I bought a few years ago and it was what influenced me to buy the Reflex. SMH, FN.

@BagsEsquire

17w

Any new updates by chance? Interested to hear if you went back to FN again.

@chargerman440

35w↑9

Friend of mine had the same low and left problem with his new Hellcat, and I had the same problem with a Mossberg MC2C. This is why it’s always important to test the accuracy of your guns before your life depends on it

@stufoo

35w↑14

sounds like you and your friend should have tested your trigger fingers at the range...

@N8R_Quizzie

35w↑4

@@stufoohaha took the words outta my mouth. I wonder if he has a gun that doesn't have that problem....

@nazinuts

32w

@stufoo how accurate are factory sights though? Does every company test their sights and make sure theyre aligned before sale?

@mybuickskill6979

35w

I think with an optic most folks won't even see how crappy the irons are lol. Hopefully you guys can get that situation figured out. 🤗
This is the first review I've seen of the reflex with that issue. 🤔

@rudydedogg6505

34w↑1

Chris, I made it out to the range this morning and came up with a sighting method that works for me. Per the FN Customer Support Rep, I placed the red dot on the front sight over the center of the target but instead aligning the two white dots on the rear sight with the red dot, I centered the red dot along the top edge of the rear sight so that the upper half of the red dot was over the top of the rear sight and the lower half was below the top of the rear sight. Goofy, I know, but it put the rounds right where I wanted them in elevation. To correct for the rounds hitting to the left of target center, I modified my grip on the gun. As you know, there isn't a lot of real estate on the handle so getting my left/support hand where I normally have it wasn't working. What I did instead was apply a bit of pressure to the right up by the trigger guard in addition to and instead of simply pulling straight back. It helped a lot BUT, I do not believe that a pistol that exists solely as a personal defense weapon should expect to be held and sighted any differently from the way I've been shooting for the past few decades. IF I have to use this it will be because of a mortal concern and I may very well need to get rounds off fast and accurately relying on practiced muscle memory.
I saw a third YouTube review of the Reflex yesterday and the shooter was experiencing the exact same round placement issues you, me and two other reviewers experienced. In my never-to-be-humble opinion, FN needs to address this by, at least, offering to adjust the sights to the owner's specifications. I'm sorry to say that I should have purchased the model with the optics cut but who would have thought that such large errors with a target only 21 feet away would prove to be such an issue?

@mdjbm

35w↑1

I’ve been shooting my reflex for 2 months now… sights are perfect.. nice bullseye groups… really enjoying shooting and carrying…

@joematiacio3449

35w↑33

My reflex was shooting left and low also. Not quite as low. PSA - a MGW Glock sight pusher with the 43/43x adapter works on the FN Reflex.

@mangadrawer1000

35w↑5

I swear all of them are off the same out the box. Everyone’s first shot videos have the gun shooting low left. And mines did the same.

@cjdebono8811

35w

I got my hellcat out the box without adjusting anything and was on target. You need to return this gun

@117TheWolf

35w↑1

@@cjdebono8811That’s funny, because my sister’s Hellcat needed about the same POA as Outlaw’s Reflex. Maybe having one anecdotal account of a pistol doesn’t mean jack ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@kennethchapman9564

35w↑5

I truly appreciate your honesty about this subcompact FN. I was shopping for a new EDC and didn't like the feel of that one in my hands. After watching a much better shot than myself shoot it I would be better off throwing it at my target.

@whatsup24_7

35w↑2

It's not a subcompact, it's a micro compact

@zeus_tha_truth2025

35w

Just clobbering your targets 😂😂

@johnherrera4806

29w

One review shouldn’t deter you from getting one

@whatsup24_7

29w

@@johnherrera4806 The Masada Slim is a much better choice over the FN Reflex. It's better in every way except color. I wish the Slim was available in FDE.

@rudydedogg6505

35w↑10

Chris, I have an update for you regarding the sights on the Reflex. I just got off the phone with FN Customer Service and was told that there was an error in the manual regarding proper positioning of the front sight. The manual illustrates the top of the front sight centered on the target just like usual. The Rep said that this was in error, that the dot in the front sight should be placed over the center of the target in what he termed a "Combat Hold" and that corrections were being made to the manual. He advised not to file the front sight as the tritium insert was close to the top of the sight and its purchase may be jeopardized. I hope to try this sight alignment out soon and I'll give you feedback on what I get. If you have time to try it with your Reflex, I'd like to hear what you experience.

@odysseusnissan

22w

I've always wanted a newer FN with a red dot mount...but I live in CA and haven't done so yet. I wish you couldve reviewed it with a red dot installed. Major props to your Kentucky windage skills. I had to do a rifle qual as a Marine in Guam pre typhoon with ridiculous wind and rain. Only 2 of us in the platoon qualified. At 500 I was aiming at the target to the right.

@carlmontney7916

35w↑7

For a company with a reputation like FN has I am actually very surprised that the sights are so far off on this particular pistol. A lot of times low left is caused by bad or uneven trigger pulls. That said. When a pistol is fired by a shooter as competent as you are and consistently is hitting low left it's the gun not the shooter. Granted you can always adjust the sights or swap them out, but like I said I would expect more from a company like FN.

@JeffJBuck

35w

Your first time shooter has zero chance with this turd.

@bjdog42

35w↑1

My Hellcat sights were low too but at least centered. The tritium stayed in but the luminous ring around it came out during a class so I fixed the problem with an XS Big Dot set that were on for elevation. I rarely leave home without it now.

@LimeTimeHD

35w↑2

I wonder if they did the internal hammer design just to have a feature that sets themselves apart from the competition. If they were to come out with a striker fired variant with shorter trigger pull/reset it would be a much more enticing imo.

@jamesmichalski3610

19w

Best reviews. Hands down. Saved alot of money and time watching your reviews. Thanks.

@gregdownend3604

28w↑5

After watching more reviews recently, the low left thing is way too common on this new gun, all by experienced shooters. Someone stated FN claims it’s made for combat grip which maybe explains the low but not the left. I really want to like this gun, but want to understand what the issue is before I buy

@wardduncan-oit8365

16w

I had to push the rear sight over just a smidge and I was way more center than left. I haven't been able to bring myself the file down the front sight yet. But that would be next. I have read from others that replaceing the sights with the Trijicon Sig P365 DI #8 sights will fix this issue. But why should I have to?

@Somewhp

35w↑1

Always conflicted by these continued offerings. Always great to see competition, but no one seems to really be outpacing the 365 or shield plus as a total value package.

@tomasteply1956

27w

They sometimes outpace it with higher capacity or in price (at least in Europe the Sig and Shield plus are like 15% more expensive than hellcat)

@ericrude4416

35w↑14

Thank you for this review. The FN Reflex definitely is not worth the "best in class" hype, especially for the price. I think I'll stick with my decision to get the IWI Masada Slim for my next EDC.

@peternorth1721

35w

Next every day carry? How every day carries do you carry e every day? 🤔

@araneaetvelivolum1086

35w↑1

I just got rid of my Masada Slim. I tried to love that gun, I really did but it just didn't work for me. Snappy as hell and although I bore sighted it, no chance to hit shit even with the red dot
Replaced it with a shield plus or TS. Right out of the box I am hitting A zone from 5, 7, 10 yds. I should have test shot the Masada S before I bought it ... But I didn't which cost me 200$.

@ericrude4416

35w↑2

@@peternorth1721 It's nice to have options in your EDC rotation based on what you're doing, where you're going, and/or what you're wearing.

@danielpadgett2831

35w

@@peternorth1721😂

@abettermind

35w

@peternorth1721 hahaha, derp

3 More Replies...

@scottbryant9425

35w

Had high hopes as i like FN generally but after checking this one out at the shop, i cant justify the cost against other options.

@krmtdfrg

29w

Just picked up one of these with the optic option, its called FN Reflex MRD. Can't wait to get it to the range later this week.

@murphtahoe1

35w↑2

I would love to see a follow up after you have completed the changes to the sights and have a 500-1000 rounds through the pistol.

@werealldoomed7643

35w

Looking to enter the micro 9 market, was debating between the P365 and this. My choice for the P365 is officially solidify, however once the kinks are worked out on the reflex, I see a next potential buy for me but not right now. Tbf to the reflex, the P365 had a rough start to.

@gtiguy1992able

23w

365x the grip is a bit bigger

@wc4201

32w

Great review. Factory triggers are usually meh to bad… not sure why when CZ can do a good trigger on a $400 gun. FN is notorious for bad triggers in overpriced guns. That said I’m sure it’s better than my daily G43. I am looking to upgrade and didn’t opt for the 365 due to the trigger issues. This looks like a good option.

@alextownsend8624

29w

Pull the trigger and go for it! I swapped my p365 and shield plus for it and have no regrets, super concealable, everything is rounded and smooth on it, low bore axis, overall well made nice shooting handgun. You'll forget its even on you even with sweatpants, shorts, etc.

@mi_cheap_guns2925

35w

This reminded me of my Hudson H9, very nice iron sights on it but I don’t think they went together. My Hudson was shooting inline but like 6” low, had to swap out a different front sight. POA/POI is excellent now. Sad out of a new gun though.

@MaxUmi

35w↑11

Please do a full review!
I keep going back and forth whether to pick this one up...
Reliability is king for me. Obviously having the sights on and aligned is highly important too 😅

@lancesomething93

35w↑3

This thing seems to ring steel every single time you pull the trigger, but with this kinda accuracy I'd rather just go buy a cr920, SIG or 43x cuz atleast they're gonna shoot straight out of the factory every time.

@brandonUwanawich954

35w↑4

@@lancesomething93shield plus or Hellcat over the 43x all day

@Rpalacios29623

35w↑1

If you want an alternative I recommend you checking out the IWI Masada slim. Honest outlaw does a good review of it and it’s about $150 cheaper and sights are dead nuts on. I was hitting in the 9,8, and 7 ring on a B27 target from 70 yards. Absolutely zero misses

@HWG-wm8ld

35w↑1

A hellcat may fall into the same size category but not the quality of Glock. It’s a budget gun made with lower grade materials.

@chivalryremains9426

35w

@HWG Then why does it cost more than a Glock?

2 More Replies...

@PatriotTown

31w

Most honest reviewer I've heard yet. Already bought this one so now I know what I need to do when it comes in. Thanks

@johnherrera4806

29w

You may not have to do a thing to it .

@marvnation924

35w↑1

Several other people and reviewers have also had their impacts low and left not unlike yours, so it seems this isn't a one off issue but a very regular problem with these Reflex's at FN's factory. Otherwise they seem great.

@Miketoomanyhobbies

35w

Can’t wait for the next video on this Fn ! Really interested in this for a EDC. HOPING YOU CAN GET THE accuracy down

@davisor7116

35w

Being from Europe I never pay attention to micros ( CC not allowed ) but this one I really like, especially because it's not a striker fired but has the same dimensions.
It's clearly a high quality little handgun and I would get one but it's not available in my country as of yet which is ironic since I live next door to Belgium.
I'm guessing this one is made in USA and only in USA?

@Puller1944

35w↑1

Mine came with two sets of screws but I used the screws that were on the cover plate that came with the fun and the optic was a Holosun ESP Carry and they worked.

@josiaheck4865

35w↑4

I got a Shield+ earlier this year and was baffled at first. I'm no pro, but I'm also no slouch in pistol accuracy, never shot a gun that small before but my accuracy was consistently bad. Upon closer inspection, my sights were off just like the ones on this FN. Doesn't help that it means you're shooting low and left (as a righty) so everyone and every search result tells you that you suck, not the gun, get a pro's opinion or just learn how to shoot. I wanted some night sights anyways, so after a painful swapping of the sights, I just eyeball-ed the sights to be centered and now I'm just as accurate with my Shield+ as I am with every other polymer gun I've fired. Other than that experience, the pistol is everything I could've asked for and more.

It's frustrating to get unpolished assembly guns like this out of the box from respected companies. Not a deal breaker, but very disappointing when you see consistent fantastic reviews and results from everyone else, but get what you get. I feel like any adjustable sight pistol has the possibility of being off like this, it's just crazy to me that something like this can make it past any level of quality check, you can look at it closely and just tell.

Just a dose of my opinion and related experience here, thanks for the consistent honesty, Mr. And Mrs. Outlaw.

@mikewithers299

35w↑1

I didn't have that problem with my Shield Plus. Sights were centered and I did measure them, but I did shoot low and left for a little while. Turns out I was over gripping that snappy little gun too much. Once I loosened up my grip a little, and stopped trying to control the extra recoil, my shots starting going center. I confirmed this technique on a 10mm and a 45. I was pleasantly surprised by my results. I'm no pro, but handed it to a pro to try out. His shot (one) was dead center. I knew it had to be my grip. I almost sold it, but spent time finding the problem so I could keep it. I was more accurate with my original Shield, and that bothered me. So I started trying different grip techniques and it worked. Good luck brother

@josiaheck4865

35w↑1

@@mikewithers299
Yea, that's what my first thought was with mine - that it was me. But like 4 other people with me (I like big range days with friends when the schedules align for everyone) and everyone was doing bad with it.
My next outing solo at an indoor range I was far more focused, taking my time with it and yeilded relatively tight groups consistently in the 8/8:30 o clock direction. So a little of that was me still, but I looked at the sights top down and it was obvious how off they were. I asked the employees at the range to take a look and they agreed.
Usually the shooter is to blame, but sometimes the QC just missed the correct alignment.. somehow?
Glad you were able to get that down.

@mikewithers299

35w↑1

@josiaheck4865 I had read other comments before I bought it saying the same thing. Sights were off not only on the Plus but other M&P series. I had just changed my OG Shield sights to Tru Glo, and took measurements on the Plus. It was dead nuts. Range time showed it was off. Typical low left with very focused shots. I tried my full size M&P the same grip and techniques. It was spot on. I figured it out later what I was doing wrong, but that was after buying the 10mm and going thru the same problem in a full size M&P.

@bermo61

33w

I have always liked FN pistols because of their military heritage, but found them a little less refined than HK. Good review.

@bobbarker5884

35w↑12

Chris please check through the box thoroughly for a little baggie with 4 screws. Look under the plastic tray where the gun lock is. Also check the manual for which screws to use with your optic

@matthewgonzalez1346

35w↑19

I was really excited for this gun. Finally got to check one out at a local store. It felt like a hunk of cheap plastic and the trigger was very disappointing. With an internal hammer and being FN I was expecting a lot more. Good thing I have an xmacro😁

@ODB357

35w↑3

Hate my Xmacro, as much as I tried to love it, I just couldn’t :/

@riccochet704

35w

I agree, the trigger is trash. Long, stacks and unpredictable.

@charlieboi6370

35w

@ODB357 that's why I'll stick with my p365 with optics ready slide

@ODB357

35w↑1

@@charlieboi6370 I had changed the frame to the smaller Wc frame and I felt like it only got worse, sunks hundreds into it just to get rid of it….

@Osprey1994

35w↑1

@@ODB357Good thing you can change literally everything abput it if you so choose. Would be nice to know what you disliked, the P365 at base is just a good shooter, and the bigger you make it the easier it is to shoot. So why you "hated" it I am very curious. Now of course some people are a bit liberal with the word hate, and that might be the core of the problem here.

6 More Replies...

@edwardbohlman3209

35w↑1

I was thinking about picking up one of these, so thanks for the initial review. I'm reluctant to pick up another micro-9 that isn't as good as my Mossberg MC2sc (which you never tested). But speaking of FDE pistols, are you ever going to do a final review of the Area Delta?

@MJA5

35w↑17

I have a 509 mid, FN pistols are nice quality and in my hand nicer than many competitors. They are solid.

@ikamfuey

35w↑1

So close to getting the reflex until this review. I’m now reconsidering other options. But that’s a good thing. We need honesty!

@mikemcmanus116

35w↑15

Good review. Honestly after watching videos on whatever the "newest & best" flavor of the month, I remain satisfied with my Glock 19, 26, and 43. They work well without a lot of hassle. Reliable and no drama.

@juanhuttoe4517

35w↑4

Yeah I have a 365xl that is great. It's been 100% from day 1. I'm still thinking about a glock 19/26 combo though. I mean the 26 while a little chunky Is a do all edc then I'd throw the 19 on the nightstand. Glock mags are everywhere so I would never have a problem putting hands on them.

@MrRolloBaggins

35w↑4

Love my 26. I've had it for years. Time to get the slide milled tho.

@Osprey1994

35w↑1

@@juanhuttoe4517Go 45 over the 19. Even with a Mechanix L glove size, my support hand pinky hangs off the bottom of the 19.5.

@HWG-wm8ld

35w↑1

OP, the 19 has been on my side since 97’. I don’t get why people want or need something newer just to have the new thing. Waiting on a custom holster and buying magazines, sights, spare parts…etc. for these guns doesn’t make sense to me

@ColonelCarnage

35w

I just switched from the 19 to the 48 for carry. Noticeably more comfortable.

1 More Replies...

@ryanscarphone4672

35w↑1

I'm used to strictly caniks, and I have a feeling my next purchase, I will be disappointed no matter what I get. Trigger on the mecaniks are PERFECT, accuracy even when I think im off or cant make the shot, is incredibly surprising. I better just get thr glock 26 for my second one. I don't wanna have to wonder if I spent my 500 bucks on something I will KINDA like. This gun is kinda like the beretta apx carry, small thing. Trigger is crap. Big name, ok ish gun. Same here

@Zombie_Doof

35w↑3

I've been saving up for this side arm but every HONEST review i see it's all shooting low left. how can FN release a gun like that?! I'm going to wait a bit and see if they work out the iron sight issues

@laserbrain7774

24w

You are both getting so good at this.

@deeredoctor

35w↑1

KelTec P11 was SA, internal hammer, 8lb trigger. Was my first 9mm. I really was not a fan of heavy and long pull on the trigger.

@willwilliam217

35w

The only fn that I own is a high power new model. It has a very long reset also but the trigger is very good once you get used to it.

@morotetsuke

35w

This is why you have to see as many reviews as possible. I’ve noticed so many other channels just spoon feed us the company line time and time again.

@johnfriend862

35w↑1

I've looked at a few FN's over the last 10 years, I wasn't impressed by any of them. Too many issues for a duty/off duty/backup weapon. Lack of duty gear is a huge concern. The FNX thumb safety locks the hammer forward if it gets flipped on while carrying, terrible idea.
For a backup or minimal carry pistol an optic would be too bulky, so reasonable open sight accuracy is kind of necessary. I sold my G43, been looking for a replacement. The Canik is a possibility, your reviews are very refreshing and most welcome.

@ByronETAWheels

34w

I hope that this comment helps someone. The FN Reflex has #8 stock height front and #6 rear sight.

I had amazing results after swapping in a Trijican Di #8 rear sight from a Sig 365, and it will definitely shine if you take the time to dial it in.

I'd rather have that vs an optic.

@rudydedogg6505

34w↑1

Mine shoots 3 1/2" low consistently and FN will not alter the sights. I'm going to replace my rear sight as you did. Thank You!!

@colosim5507

35w↑13

Guy at the range let me shoot one of these today. Ergonomics we’re great, not snappy at all, and the trigger felt nice. The reset was rough though. Wouldn’t replace my shield plus PC or MC9 (w/ post-release recoil spring and fixed extractor spring)

@charlieboi6370

35w↑1

Mc9 is a definite sleeper

@Osprey1994

35w↑1

@@charlieboi6370It's not...what are you talking about? The MC9 had issues that got swept under the rug, but once it's fixed it's exactly what people expected. A small Canik that has a trigger like a PPQ/PDP.

@brandonUwanawich954

35w

@@charlieboi6370I sold my MC9 owning it for a week worst gun I ever bought and I feel stupid that I thought I was replacing my Elite Sc with it gun couldn’t go 1 mag without a malfunction

@colosim5507

35w

@@brandonUwanawich954 had similar problems at first. After breaking it in, I was still having about a 2% RTB issue. After Century sent a free lighter recoil spring and lighter/shorter extraction kit springs, it runs like a dream

@charlieboi6370

35w

@@brandonUwanawich954 sorry to hear that. Most ppl who own that I've talked to like it a lot.

@nealgold8442

35w↑8

@chase1053

35w↑2

Always enjoy your absolute honesty 👋

@JK13A

34w↑1

Seems like you got a dud when it comes to the factory zero for sure. Definitely want to see it after you re-zero the sights.

@TrentFalkenrath

35w↑1

One thing I'd like to add. Just because Chris doesn't like accuracy doesn't mean you would too. I was testing a bunch of carry guns including a p365 and Hellcat. If just went from what the internet told me, I would've just bought the p365, but when I shot it, she shot like dogshit. Now, before ya say it's a skill issue, I put down a group the size of a sticky note using the Hellcat. Same target, same distance, same day even. Just goes to show how personal a decision it is to choose a handgun.

@hartsickdisciple

35w

The Sig P365 and P320 FCUs are significantly different. They don't have a lot in common, other than both being swappable to other frames. The P320 is just a P250 converted into a striker-fired gun. The P365 is a "native" striker-fired design. Nothing about the P320 should be assumed to true about the P365.

@Cholc9

35w↑7

Im glad this review came out. I'm wanting a good edc, and the Shield Plus seems to be the way to go.

@mikewithers299

35w↑1

I have the Plus and it's awesome. I loved the OG Shield too. Try the Plus first if you can. See if it's a good fit for you. I have large hands and have no problems with recoil or manipulation of the controls. 3" groups out it at 10 yards for my average ability

@josiaheck4865

35w

I just posted my experience with the Shield+ in these comments. It's my current (and first) edc and I like it a lot, but I recommend you give my comment a read as it's pretty relevant to what you said here.

@jesseboutdoors

35w↑14

That rear sight would of drove me nuts to do a whole video with it that far off.

@NickLoecke

35w

I'm impressed by your ability to adjust for Kentucky Windage, particularly at that kind of distance

@clintwestwood1895

35w↑2

Great honesty as always Honest Outlaw!

@willkiker6892

20w

Full review with an optic please! Would love to get your final thoughts soon because I got an itch that needs to be scratched! 😂

Love your content. Thank you!

@Cobb

35w↑5

Been looking forward to this review.
The grip texture seems like the XD grips.
Shame about the optic and sight problems out of the box.

@Osprey1994

35w↑1

I don't see it. The grip looks like a shrunk down 509.

Also which genation of the XD? The last generation was super wonky.

@stephenwise7412

35w

Enjoy your channel and watch regularly. My optics ready reflex came with screws in the box for most common red dots.

@kevinlee6205

35w↑1

Just got this gun and shot it yesterday. 100 percent agree the reset is definitely long coming from shooting the 365xl I thought it was just me

@verblvik

35w↑1

I own this gun and I've owned a 365, this FN is miles better than the sig. It feels higher quality and it doesn't feel like the mag is going to shake loose like the sig. FN is late to the game but made the best micro 9 out there. The only other complaint I have is the name, its corny. Other than that I love this thing

@believe722

35w↑1

I'd have to check this one out in person, because I've never been much of an FN fan. You to have such a good channel it sucks when you get a crappy gun to review. To me this was a typical FN, and in my mind that's less than desirable, and too big for their britches on what they want for their guns. Just not worth the price in my mind.

@TonyLalande

35w

I was super looking forward to this gun. The sights being off definitely has me questioning tho....

@davidatticus5179

35w↑1

Great review. A Canik/FN comparison would help a lot of us decide. Look forward to that. Thanks!

@casualconcealedcarry

35w↑3

Holding out for the MRD version but they are hard to find. Love FN, so this could be a contender to replace my 365

@Tmay_

35w

Iv been waiting for this! Love your reviews, thanks for all the info look forward to the follow up review

@willwilliam217

35w

Had a beretta 92x that was shooting very low but center. $800 handgun, spent about $500 thru ltt and beretta to try to repair. Still shot very low, parted ways with it.

@jetman1979

19w

I really hope sig can send out the pistols with properly zeroed sights.
I really like the pistol but I really don’t want to use Kentucky windage on a new pistol.

@Gobirds5

35w↑2

I purchased the non mos version last month. Finally went and shot it and I was shooting 6-8 inches low at 25 feet. Was doing everything in my power to ensure it wasnt my trigger pull but was not sure. Glad I have some confirmation that i am not crazy. Gun performs well in every other way. Hope a fix comes out for it

@hartsickdisciple

35w

A fix for that would probably involve replacing the front sight.

@captainamer71

33w

Shooter error
Down flicking
Unless muzzle has a burr

@javiergonzalez5998

35w↑1

Personally I had a terrible experience with both FN pistols I owned. One a compact 9mm jammed every 5 rounds, the other one a full size 40 cal was off center every time, my opinion buy a sig or a glock.

@bradb69

32w

I purchased a fn reflex and the springfield hellcat same day and then watched your video before I shot. Fast forward a few weeks and then I finally made my way out to the range. I shoot 1% as much as you but when I was at the range I also noticed my FN shooting low and to the left. I couldnt remember which gun it was you said did that. My suspicions were right when I came back to the video. It does seem FN has an issue with their site alignments from the factory. I have never moved iron sites around though so I am unsure how to fix the elevation issue. Left to right on the rear will obviously fix the left issue.

@mr920xsnob2

35w↑4

In Chris defense (like he needs it from the likes of me) his low left is not snatching the trigger, pistol looked incredibly stable as he broke the shot.

And oh yeah he’s one of the best marksmen on gun tube close range or from a different state. Those of us that follow this channel remember the shot from 300yards standing off hand with a staccato either it was a c2 or a P he teased that shot at the end of one of his videos. Absolutely incredible.

Chris which video was that! And what did you do it with?!

@prazcuray1388

35w

Wouldn’t mind seeing a comparison video, looking to go back into carrying a micro nine, rocking a G45 right now cause I’m a big guy.

@midwestg4105

35w↑1

I too like your honest reviews and was ready to add this pistol to my collection but will not. I will keep my Sig P365 as my primary carry gun with my S&W Shield in .45 as my alternate carry gun. Thx again.

@thanossstewart3800

35w↑1

Love and enjoy the Honest review's to you both yes let's see a further review on this little guy please

@southfork67

35w

Well it was certainly reliable. Other than that I don’t know why anyone who has a 365 would want this one. Thanks for the video.

@philsmgb4393

35w

Bought one of these for my wife. We haven't shot it yet but I do like the heavier trigger like my 1st generation Taurus Millennium.

@robgray_

35w

I assume the left to right issue can be fixed by adjusting the rear sight, but how would you correct the elevation issue?

@bw1819

35w↑10

Got this in my hands yesterday at a local range. Didn’t care for the feel in hand or the trigger. Employees also didn’t care for the gun.

@kmarlatt1

35w↑1

I held one at a gun show last weekend. The 15 rd mag has sharp corners on it. I had high hopes for it with the internal hammer, but couldn’t get past the uncomfortable grip.

@peters303

35w

Thats shocking that a gun passed their production quality control.
Visually you saw the rear sight was way off centre
Like they say, in production there's never 100%

@johnkrstyen7351

35w↑1

Same problem with my Shield plus optic ready. Have a regular Shield Plus with three white dots sight and enjoyed it so decided to get one to put a red dot on. I shoot dead on at 10 yards with the 3 dot sights then took the optic ready and shoot off to the left side 4-5 inches. Not a problem after putting a dot on but if the dot ever goes down and I need to use irons in a self defense going to be shooting left.

@spskkaf

28w

I had no issues mounting the EPS Carry to the Reflex, using the flat topped screws that came in the FN box. No plate needed.

@user-vk2rl5sv5r

28w

I like your videos and your opinion. I have noticed yout not a fan of smaller micros anyway. Guns are fit to each individuals preferences. ive shot 1500 rds on mine and its been accurate out of the box. i personally like it. All guns have issues its just a matter of what you wanna deal with id more then not people like this gun . good video yes holsters are hard to come by.

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