Still Not Smokin
R.E.K Lyrics

Bassicly I was just born bastard, long for greener pastures
I am a pheonix, I was born from the ashes
The forms you take in the storm is what you makes strong
Anybody could perfrom like a charm when the waters calm
Ya'll don't know nothing 'bout the things I've been faced with
Can ya'll relate how I came from the basement?
I make the music and the same time faced it
I've been so close to my dreams I can taste it

Come on and punish me, the only thing that keeps me sane

I look to you for things I can not change
I need your blessing, do you approve?
My best was never good enough for you

So this is how it feels and it doesn't feel so good
To you could have given up after giving all you could
Its been raining for so long its like the sun will never shine
I've been losing for so long, I think I fell too far behind

I've trailed beneath the icy waters, Im comming up for air
I've spent my whole life living for those who didn't even care

So this is how it feels and it doesn't feel so good
To know you could have given up after giving all you could
Its been raining for so long its like the sun will never shine
I've been losing for so long I think I fell too far behind

I sat and thought for a while today
I got depressed and put the smiles away, 'cause I've been struggling
Since back in my childhood days,
I've been walkin' since forever still Im miles away
Maybe ya'll never forgave for my wilder days,
even though now Im more wise in my ways Im losing faith in myself
Sometimes I doubt I'll even make it myself,
Whose gonna give it to me, if I don't take it myself?

Come on and punish me, the only thing that keeps me sane
I look to you for things I can not change
I need your blessing, do you approve?
My best was never good enough for you

So this is how it feels and it doesn't feel so good
To know you could have given up after giving all you could
Its been raining for so long its like the sun will never shine
I've been losing for so long I think I fell too far behind

Lyrics © O/B/O APRA AMCOS

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Most interesting comments from YouTube:

Porter Blaze

4y↑1

@Reiver Neriah
"it's only a matter of time before the vast majority of us give up meat"

And you want to talk about being in the minority?
Lab grown meat is still extremely controversial, and while it has its place, specifically in the space exploration sector

As a legitimate alternative to actual meat it is simply not viable, and probably won't be in the foreseeable future

At least for the majority

Shendue

4y↑4

@ryan barker Did you even watch Star Trek AT ALL?
The affirmation of individuals is still very much a thing.
And replicators are just commodities, pretty much very evolved versions of the space rations astronauts eat NOW. Whoever wants to cook, can do it no problem and does it. Sisko's dad has a restaurant. Members of the Enterprise constantly reference how they would like to eat this or that actual food but they can't in space, just at home.
There are "pleasure planets" where people go to engage in free love, basically.
There are several sports. Everyone has different hobbies and cultural interests.
Riker likes playing the sax. Picard likes history, archeology and literature.
They play poker.
On Earth, there's no need for money, but they can still have personal properties. Picard collects memorabilia and old books. They probably exchange them for services, something that already exist nowadays.
If you think that people are incapable of being culturally defined and diverse without their suffering and negative aspects, you have a pretty bleak and nihilistic vision of reality.
ST future is an evolved, post economic society. You look at it like if it were a marxist dystopia, where everyone is equal. That's Brave New World, not ST.
ST has a post-communist, post-consumerist society, in which there are still very much different cultures, there is still interpersonal conflict (not large scale conflicts, but only because there is ONE centralized government), and there's lot of issues.
Technology and the evolution of society reduced discrimination (LaForge isn't discriminated against), but didn't completely remove it (Data is).
People don't act out of greed for money, but sometimes they do out of greed for power (see the various shady federation higher ups in the series).
Humans are still very much human.
They just removed money from the equation, which made crime decrease dramatically, and improved the life of all people by reducing (not completely eliminating) social differences.
There are still ideological arguments. Maquis are a prime example.
Drugs were eliminated, which is a GOOD thing. And still the occasional indulgence isn't punished harshly, but instead tolerated unless it can cause serious issues (nobody arrests Guinan for having actual alcohol).

r0bw00d

4y↑8

Captain Janeway woke up a 0600. Her body fought to return to unconsciousness, but she forced herself out of bed and prepared herself for the day, which included attaching a phaser to her uniform. The Borg had been making themselves quite the nuisance lately so she was keeping Voyager at modified red alert--the ship continued to function as if under normal circumstances, but the crew was kept armed at all times and all hands were continuously on alert to man battle stations in an instant.

The corridor lights blinded her as she left her quarters, cup in hand. Janeway had to make her way to the mess hall to get her morning coffee. Energy for replicator usage was kept to minimum due to the outside threat, but Neelix was able to get his hands on some local version of coffee beans and stock up on them--it would be from him that she would have to get her elixir, the drink that allowed her to perform miracles. She waited impatiently for her slow legs and even slower turbolift to grant her access to the one room on the ship that she needed now more than any other.

Upon entering the mess hall, however, Janeway immediately spotted trouble. Neelix was in the dining area, petrified as he spoke to none other than the Borg Queen. She didn't know how the queen was able to board her ship without detection, but one matter was certain: it would never happen again. The queen gave the captain her penetrating stare and wicked smile and said, "Hello, Catherine. Good to see you again."

Neelix turned to the queen and shouted, "No!"

Janeway didn't hesitate. She withdrew her phaser, shot at the queen, and her enemy vaporized before her eyes. The phaser was returned as quickly as it had been snatched up.

"I tried to warn her, Captain!" Neelix said in a panic. Janeway stared at him patiently, but her eyes burned hotter than the fires of Hell. Neelix scurried to the other side of the bar and grabbed a metal pitcher. "Freshly brewed!" he consoled. "Finished about a minute ago!"

Janeway placed her cup on the counter with great restraint and Neelix immediately poured the hot liquid into it. The captain brought the cup up to her nose, smelled the aroma, took a sip, and then closed her eyes and smiled. All was right with the universe once more.

All comments from YouTube:

NoOther1

4y↑58

I actually loved the episode of Orville about this topic, where cigarettes were literally something only though of in an archaeological context and Bortus getting hooked was something they immediately understood was a medical condition and jumped in to treat.

everyone

4y↑1.3K

Vapes in Star Trek are the most cringe thing they could have added. They're up there with the microwave 3D printers.

wolfpax22

2y↑1

@Busco.O I feel like they were desperately trying to make Picard trendy by drawing on more recent sci fi like Mass Effect. Rios' ship is more like a vessel from the Mass Effect universe than the Star Trek one by feel. The funny thing is, I know people hate the Kelvin timeline films but at least the felt more like Trek aesthetically, even if they were more action oriented.

Shotgun Mongol

The 3D printers being used as replicators is absolutely weird to see and stupid looking, but I do on one level kind of like them, because it's kind of like a homage to the fact replicators are partly the inspiration for 3D printers.

As for the vaping, no excuse, it's just plain cringe, and I vape for god's sake!

oriontherealironman

3y↑1

@ezakustam
Thank you I had hoped that I eloquently brought my point across. It's had when you get into an internet troll fight 🤣

ezakustam

3y↑2

@oriontherealironman
Well said. Even DS9 didn't usually glorify the problems. It only insisted that some of them still existed.

CataclysmDM

Right? I saw the vaping and I just thought.... no. HELL no. This is not the future.

43 More Replies...

Emperor Of The Scrubs

4y↑307

Its like handing someone the keys to an antique car and then watching them crash into a fire hydrant

Mark Burgess

So accurate it hurts

Anthyrion

3y↑1

@uroborous01 I think, you forgot that the guy who had driven the car into the hydrant/stonewall is laughing in full joy while pissing into the flames. Because he intentionally crashed into it and KNEW that it would ruin a masterpiece

NO No, Just No!

i think its more like being given, the keys and re-enacting the scene from Abrahms trek only its not a shipyard its an active volcano.

uroborous01

4y↑2

Crash into a fire hydrant then set it on fire and piss on the flames morelike.

Dr. Strangelove

4y↑1

... Crash into a fire hydrant intentionally...

It was ruined intentionally.

6 More Replies...

GermanOlle

4y↑433

I fully agree to smoking. However, one has to say that drinking alcohol was not frowned upon in Star Trek. Whiskey and Romulan Ale were very popular even among the Federation. But don't forget: Scotty and his Whisky, the Klingons with their Blood Wine, the Cardassians with their Kanar, Romulans with their Ale etc.

wolfpax22

Except for The Final Frontier and maybe a few other exceptions, Star Trek has always adhered strongly to Roddenberry's vision that smoking would be abandoned by the 23rd century. I reasoned that the ambassador to Nimbus III was some scumbag by Federation standards. Nimbus III seemed like the place that the 3 interstellar powers wanted to dump their trash. So he shouldn't be indicative of what's normal in the Federation. I always figured that the cigarettes and cigars from the holodeck were toned down to be easily consumable and non-hazardous so that someone could smoke them for flair without the other effects. Picard is certainly an aberration from all of this but I find new trek to be pretty cringe in general.

Jessica Slater

The reason drugs were frowned upon in TNG while alcohol wasn't is because it aired during the height of the D.A.R.E. era.

Jure Humar

Our society has an almost abnormal tolerance for alcohol. One of the most destructive drugs and the most tolerated. It's sad.

Das Institut

@MannHesse! Nah. It really differs from person to person. sure Picard would probably only drink on special days, or moments, but other might drink a zip on a daily basis. And it's both fine.
And the smoking part? I have nothing against it, though I think in that paradise world smoking is neither toxic, nor stinky.

Emperor Marcus Aurelius Antoninus Augustus

Exceptions to the rule.

38 More Replies...

David P

4y↑780

You know why they have their character smoke, drink and do drugs?

Means they have to write less dialogue...and that takes talent.

Max Utley

@EricLynchSucks the Sopranos wasnt miserable its a bunch of fat guys who like specialty salami and just happen to be mobsters on the side, I havent laughed that much in years

KReGaDeTH

EricLynchSucks given the option to eat edibles or smoke pot, I choose smoking. Why wouldn’t people choose the same? It’s just clear no one in the comments section is a smoker or a drug user and is simply upset to see it. I’m gonna go smoke. This is stupid. Good video tho

shadowshockwave

4y↑1

@drew tindall
Still a generalization about a specific demographic (smokers). I think people are right, it's the cheap "that person has been through s$&#!" Story telling cliche.

Pepcid Complete

4y↑2

No it's because theyre trying to capture the youth views & currently American youth are hurtling towards celebrated degeneracy thanks to the trash universities.

Nuclearsimian

4y↑6

@EricLynchSucks When you have directors (JJ Abrams,) showrunners (Alex Kurtzman,) and writers (Micheal Chabon) that have all stated in some form or another that they don't "_get_" Star Trek or why people like it, and then they all express some form of desire to work on literally anything else, including saying they'd rather work on Star Wars, you have an extremely clear explanation for why everything from JJ's nuTrek forward just massively misses the mark.

8 More Replies...

Eric Hansen

4y↑435

Old Trek: Humanity as it could be if we embrace our capacity to learn.
New Trek: Humanity as it could be in a few centuries if we refuse to learn one single thing from 2020 forward.

DeLorean4

DS9: The 2020s in America were a hell hole, but a turning point.

iamthewizardwhoknocks

@Cuthalu Funny guy.

Evelyn Lamoy

Humanity's been smoking and drinking for millennia. Its a tradition so deeply engrained in our society that I don't think you could ever get rid of it. To me, it seems far more likely that by the 24th century, we're more likely to find ways to use science to mitigate any damage that causes, than to actually get everyone to stop.

Cuthalu

3y↑1

@wyqtor Well, the person who won against Trump is, quite frankly, infinitely more intellectual than Trump, and has fixed most of his major anti-science policies. And Trump wasn't just a symptom, he very actively made the problem even worse.

iBluefoot

4y↑1

@countdooku75 I don’t think Roddenberry would approve of this version of realism.

9 More Replies...

Chris Dawkins

4y↑52

I've recently binge watched the whole of TNG and DS9 during lockdown, and the thing that really strikes me in 2020, is just how optimistic about the future star trek is. That idea that maybe one day we actually will stop all this idiotic racism, selfish political power mongering and all the other BS we have to put up with these days. The idea that we could be so much better, if only we all worked together instead of focusing on our differences all the time.

Picard was OK, but mostly because Patrick Stewart was fantastic as always. I wish they hadn't tried to make it so dark and gritty. We have plenty of other franchises that do that so much better. IMO trek should always be optimistic. There's not enough of that in the world these days.

Brett Pierce

4y↑1

Yeah WW3 has to happen still before world peace.

Mike Bison

4y↑1

Earth went to utter shit. Some madmen built a ship in a backwaters collapse of humanity. That was fast enough for the federation to make first contact. We are currently on the path of utter destruction so that's good.

DarkNova50

4y↑781

No no no, see, drinking and smoking are just convenient, surefire ways of ensuring your audience knows just how badass and awesome your characters are, without requiring any of that pesky character development or actual writing. There's no time to show these characters actually doing anything that would let the audience draw their own conclusions; we've got too much Romulan incest, stock footage, and scenes of good ol' "JL" apologizing for any of that.

I just...wish Kurtzman would go away and leave Star Trek alone.

Terranallias

Romulan what now

metall

This is far better the TOS.

metall

hello? He saved it.

metall

Sure you should be talking about Wachtel development Lightning?

Jeff Hicks

4y↑1

@Nostripe361 I didn't watch the show, glad I didn't, but the phrase Romulus incest made me do a double take.

11 More Replies...

Artem

4y↑5

The drinking didn't bother me (all Trek had it to some extent). But the smoking/vaping looked so out of place to me. I know characters did it in certain holodeck simulations, but that was role-play, not habit...

HeathInClearLake

4y↑12

When I watch these type of videos comparing Gene Trek and Post Gene Trek, the move I've become to realize that the folks who are in charge of ST these days only see it as a vehicle to tell their stories rather than something that gave us hope and optimism.

Thuazabi

2y↑3

They see it as a way to generate maximum profit for minimum effort, nothing more. Which is completely antithetical to what Star Trek is.

Goat Mutt

4y↑373

Strange how immature the new Trek comes off as, compared to the budget and camp of the pre-21st century seasons.

Pirojf Mifhghek

4y↑2

I think the story they were trying to tell was one of advanced society's degradation, which I guess is hot these days with this modern-day fall of Rome we have going on. Gene Roddenberry on the other hand is spinning in his grave hoping someone will hook a generator up to him and save our wretched species from collapse.

RegularGnoll

4y↑4

@Rebot Somat As someone who is equally dispassionate to every Star Trek series that ever was, I can objectively claim that none was as cringy as this loud, aggressive, illogical trash.

KennyTew2

4y↑2

Rebot Somat to be honest I feel a bit sad for those who can’t enjoy new trek, I was so nervous when DSC aired, I was afraid I’d hate it. Luckily for me I didn’t, but I can understand why some were disappointed. I didn’t enjoy Picard as much as I’d hoped, but they are only one series in, a series way shorter than traditional trek, and I think they’ve set up their crew well for future series. Let’s face it 90’s trek took best part of 50 episodes to get good, so I’m not judging too much yet.

Rebot Somat

4y↑2

@KennyTew2 All good points. I love this exchange, nice to have confirmation that you aren't alone. And yeah, as I go through the series one by one, I see that they are able to be appreciated for different reasons.

KennyTew2

4y↑1

Rebot Somat it made me laugh when they were outraged that DSC changed the Klingons, like they’d never changed before? “Yes” they say, “but that was explained in ENT.”
and they have a point, but the explanation was almost 20 years later and was at best a bit shaky.

I have my criticism of the new Klingons, but by the end of the 90’s Trek they were pretty much comedy space pirates, which I loved, but ultimately they’d lost their edge, so a renewal was inevitable.

6 More Replies...

GetterRay

4y↑18

I love how out of context, it looks like Bashir, Kira and Garak just hate tabacco so much they faint.

Argos Fe

4y↑10

Yeah, Start Trek ended at the final episode of Enterprise. It was a good run and it is quite rewatchable. Not a bad timeline, we have over 500 hours of good old Trek.

Hellish Hybrid

4y↑16

I figured smoking is something only non-Federation-aligned humans from the more rough areas would do. Like people from where Tasha Yar grew up, a lawless collapsed colony. But I'm fairly sure Starfleet would definitely have regulations against it.

demilung

2y↑2

It seemed like less "a rule" thing and more something that humanity just outgrew. Star Trek use to be about the humanity that made it, that sovled it's issues and can now traverse and explore cosmos - not just as a symbol of hope for the future of humanity, but also because humanity plagues with our contemporary issues would never be able to create such a grand thing like the Starfleet. If people are still so flawed as they are now, they just wouldn't be able to do that.

Rockerboy Rage

4y↑8

That's what I thought. Kinda like in Mass Effect where you see more drinking and smoking in the Terminus Systems than anywhere else.

31aruca

4y↑71

This show is a slap in the face to all that the Next Generation, voyager, DS9 set up.

CelticWales

4y↑141

It is like the writers of Picard never saw Star Trek and decided to be "edgy" and "cool"

__

4y↑1

@MiSTaH bOmBAsTiK Spoken like someone who doesn't know or watch Star Trek. Remember what the unifier was? It wasn't a slow build up of regressivism I mean progressiveness authoritarianism or should I call it totalitarianism since people following the religion of intersectionalism now are demanding people raise the fist and bend the knee to their ideology in the streets and at restaurants. You ever stop to think that maybe the people burning people alive in violent riots, killing people in the street, and demanding all thought to align to their ideology or the use of violence and intimidation is acceptable. That maybe you, perhaps are the bad guys? Or like most leftist ideology you can only spew vitriol from on your pulpit built from the dead you create?

The_RyujinLP

4y↑3

@MiSTaH bOmBAsTiK More like the negative effects of the Trump Derangement Syndrome you liberals have. We're not the ones throwing a fit, burning down cites and killing 30+ people.

MiSTaH bOmBAsTiK

@CelticWales I understand that, but I'm arguing that had Roddenberry created Star Trek in the current climate where progressives are feckless and unable to seize the political and social narrative of this country then his vision might've been more cynical and closer to what Picard is. For all the turbulence of the '60s, there was a sense of "we shall overcome." I think that optimism had been eroded over the past two decades

CelticWales

4y↑1

@MiSTaH bOmBAsTiK But Star Trek was always about what humanity could become if we overcame that. Moreover, a lot of shitty things happen in the 21st century in the Star Trek university. There is also ways to incorporate those themes without the destruction of Star Trek lore.

MiSTaH bOmBAsTiK

4y↑3

Or they saw how we've digressed over the past 20 years and are convinced we'll never overcome the worst parts of capitalism. Roddenberry never considered the negative effects of climate change or Trumpism, etc...

1 More Replies...

Azraiel213

4y↑36

One minor point; Alcohol is still enjoyed in the 24th. Just, you know, responsibly. It's more of a rare/boutique item for special occasions than a mass-produced scourge.

Alex AKA A. Charles Ross

Or if you're Scotty 😂

SilvaDreams

@keiichimorisato98 It wasn't but real alcohol tended to be used for celebrations, Picard's brother actually had a vineyard in fact.

keiichimorisato98

Yeah, the Picard vineyard is referenced often enough in TNG. So I doubt alchohol was completely eliminated from consumption.

Marcus Björklund

4y↑4

Zid Bits I’m guessing it’s because addictions and such are frowned up on.

Zid Bits

4y↑3

I believe they also claimed to have cured lung cancer in either TNG/DS9 or VOY. I think the medicine of the future cured basically all ailments resulting from smoking, so if there's no risk, why wouldn't people smoke who enjoy it? I get why they didn't want to show it (glamorize smoking) but they're supposed to have cured many, if not most of the diseases that plague us today.

Klaus Gehrmann

4y↑1K

The Picard Characters aren‘t smart at all, so it fits.

Tetra Vega

@cqtaylor Picard is set post disaster, portraying broken people in a broken world.
Rios witnessed a Murder Suicide, and Raffi fell on hard times. Shit does shit to people...

J. Wolf

I've already forgot all their names. It's as bad as discovery. There's no addressing anyone by their names. I don't even think their ship had a name

Porter Blaze

@Peruano ML but he showed racism, alcoholism and all the other fun parts of human nature in the trek movies and series

Undiscovered country had heavy drinking and xenephobia from both klingons and humans for instance

TNG had klingons getting hammered in just about every Klingon episode

AJ Snyder

I love Elnor though. Only good character

Porter Blaze

4y↑1

27 More Replies...

ManicPandaz

4y↑294

I’d prefer condescending Boy Scout Star Trek over self deprecating Nu Trek any day.

epicsauceness100

4y↑30

At least the occasional condescension of old trek was tempered with heart and good intentions.

New trek is only tempered with... I dunno, incompetence?

matthew banta

4y↑8

I feel like you should have included that episode of The Orville where Bortus becomes the first member of his species to try tobacco. Soon him and his partner are hopelessly addicted.

Alex Vives

4y↑7

Some of the smoking scenes in TNG/DS9 are the characters playing a part such as Picard playing Dixon Hill. In Picard, the world has gone to hell and people are trying to escape their depression (Rafi smoking because her Starfleet career went down the drain after Romulus blew, Rios drinking and smoking to escape the grief of losing his commanding officer, and Seven drinking because she lost the closest thing she had to a son in Icheb

TheLoos3Goos33

4y↑186

The people who wrote Picard hate Star Trek. This is just generic sci fi action schlock with the Star Trek name tacked on as an afterthought.

Porter Blaze

No, that was Discovery, smoking and drinking were featured in Trek from the beginning
TOS onward

Clay3613

4y↑1

@Benjamin Kesler Disagree.

Benjamin Kesler

4y↑3

@Clay3613 I understand what you are saying in regard to the fictional characters in sci-fi, but in the here and now, tv shows glorifying dangerous substance abuse encourages viewers to do the same.

We very much so now have a culture that glorifies substance abuse in all forms of media; TV, Movies, Music, etc...

Clay3613

@Benjamin Kesler Medicine in the future can probably eliminate most of the negative health affects.

Benjamin Kesler

4y↑4

@Drew Tindall Yes, let's encourage everyone to kill themselves via drinking and smoking. Very enlighted.

Of course people should have the right to be idiots, but why should we encourage it.

2 More Replies...

Christopher Hammer

4y↑2

Nice catch on Troi, I never caught that one for some reason.

I consider Data liking his pipe a character trait. Its a nice quirk.

Keydogj35

4y↑1

Okay, so lets make clear that in voyager no one on the ship smoked, when they encountered a different species like the episode Tom got accused for murder etc. That doesn't prove against genes say in " no smoking " Most of these clips in the video are short enough ( without more detail ) to prove against genes say of words. Wesley's situation was completely different due to an alien device which made everyone addicted coming from Risa. Star trek Picard doesn't since that's a different universe. This video lacks in detail just to prove against genes say of words .

inceptional

4y↑1

Here's one of the biggest issues with the Discovery/Picard vision of the future: It's just a [bad] representation of almost everything that is of the now. The older Star Treks were forward looking, and indeed optimistic about the future and tried to see beyond all of the crap of the now and of the past, and indeed tried to show us a vision of such an evolved future. Current Star Trek is just everything negative from the now with some badly conceived futuristic technologies and the Star Trek name stuck onto it. Modern Star Trek--excluding the new Lower Decks show, which I actually think is far more like classic Star Trek than any of the recent live-action Star Trek shows and movies, and is actually quite good for what it is--is just badly writing, badly cast, badly acted, and badly directed crap.

And, it's not that smoking and drinking were in and of themselves the problem. It's the representation of them in the new Star Trek shows that is the problem. In TNG/DS9 you almost always saw them in the holodeck where they were trying to simulate an older time where people smoked, but it certainly wasn't the typical way they represented such things in their vision of the future. In modern Star Trek they've just shoved cigarettes and cigars and even f'n vapes in there--actually even trying to make it [vaping] look "cool"--that are taken straight out of this time and awkwardly placed in their sh*tty take on the "future". It makes the new shows seem more dated and backward thinking and ill-considered than the shows that came like 30 years later. That's how bad new Star Trek is.

Snake56

4y↑7

"The sensation is... wonderful. I have never experienced such a flavor. I feel as if I have been standing my entire life and I just sat down." - Klyden
Jokes aside, it's sad to see how much Kurtzman and his writers don't understand Star Trek.

varelion

4y↑18

Star Trek once stood for improvement and reason. Now it stands for decline and decay. Maybe a reflection of the way our civilization really goes.

Cuthalu

@Dr. Strangelove *The social media, to be precise.

Dr. Strangelove

It's very discouraging, it reflects where the nations and world are heading... The media controls the minds of many, you can see what future they want people to believe in.

I have always liked Star Trek for its optimistic attitude, sense of exploration and bits of life lessons. A lot of other sci-fi, even though I like Warhammer 40k too, are depressing dystopias that I would not want to live in. But, it seems the programming has sold, apparently some people think a Cyberpunk dystopia is something to aim for due to flashy lights, tall city structures and cybernetics, but they never consider what the setting is truly about: dystopia.

I sure hope our future is brighter, like it used to be.

Zuberi

4y↑1

I'm still not a fan of the smoking in Picard, but I had forgotten how often it appeared in other trek series. Makes it stand out a little less. Though most of those other appearances were in the form of holodeck programs and time travel shenanigans.

Anon Mouse

4y↑8

Seeing Data playing Sherlock Holmes just makes me want to rewatch the whole series over again.

Peter Klenner

4y↑6

There are obviously writers and authors out there who want to tell a story. That is okay. But what is beyond me is why they are given license to piggyback on beloved IPs like Star Trek and Star Wars and twist and contort them into a travesty. What is most frustrating with these new shows is that all of them are visually beautiful and striking (and there is no denying that) but still at the same time they are telling empty stories, void husks with nothing to take away from. It is a sad state that the more critically oriented channels of Youtube offer so much more entertainment than the actual "original" content.

Nicholas Eickman

4y↑38

It’s not like Humans didn’t understand the concept of money, they just didn’t need it on Earth, so when they came into contact with other species that used it, more often than not, they found it obnoxious.

J B

@Constitutionalist Libertarian they mention credits in TOS: trouble with tribbles.

PyrusCreed

4y↑1

@Xinkc In regards to food, it's made clear that replicated is not as good as the real thing. So it's not them being Luddites, so much as them preferring a higher quality item.

Xinkc

4y↑3

@Barry in Star Trek, especially series sprung forth from TNG, the Federation is currency-less. What they eventually explain in Deep Space Nine is that there's a special Federation fiat currency called a credit that they sometimes use for external trade. Races like the Ferengi don't accept such a currency, trading in gold-pressed latinum (the gold is worthless due to replicators, but apparently not the latinum), and have spread their preferred currency as a medium of exchange throughout the quadrant outside the Federation. Often the Federation barters with or extorts these outside polities/peoples.

Internally, the Federation appears to work off a rationing system in which people get access to quick travel and replicators based off presumed merit and need. This, coupled with the culture of self-improvement, would help incentivize success within the core and established worlds within the Federation. Border worlds and frontier planets don't have the support or infrastructure to follow the same economic structure though which can and has led to movements like the Marquis.

Also, the Federation seemingly has a diffuse Luddite movement specifically revolving around replicated food. Many characters preferring natural grown/raised food and beverages over the replicated versions or artificial alternatives like synthehol.

jsquared1013

4y↑4

@jacevicki I don't think you know what "fiat currency" means.

jacevicki

4y↑2

@Barry Federation has an electronic currency of 'credits.' They have a universal basic income, so no one goes hungry or is homeless. However most scarce resources are stuff that is unique like artworks or real estate, and there is some trade in that. Latinum is the interstellar currency since it isn't replicatible and is of value as a fiat currency to Ferrengi, who are the biggest trading faction.

2 More Replies...

uberneanderthal

4y↑28

they did everything short of having a scene in a graveyard where patrick stewart has to take a diarrhea dump on "G. Toddencherry's" tombstone. guess they had to save something for season 2.

sirnukealot84

4y↑1

I think its fun they are changing the star trek characters ideas on alcohol and tobacco back and forth between the different shows. Its like society and people in general have shifting views on whats ok and not ok. So im a way Picard feels realistic in a way even if it contradicts some of the older shows.

D Dixon

4y↑5

Don't forget JJ Abrams drunken bar scenes and the resultant bar fight in Star Trek 2009.

Aaron Walden

4y↑1

As with everything, DS9 did it Best 😊

By far the greatest Star Trek series of all. ❤

Luigi Mauricio

4y↑1

I understand vaping at least to some extent, when you remove the nicotine vaping isn't unhealthy, it's just a kind of pointless activity similar to chewing gum. However, it's still completely absurd in the context of Star Trek, their using 21st century vape pens for god sake, not even weird future fog-less ones. This is quite presumptuous since I know nothing of the lore, but they are so advanced that they probably have the technology to artificially simulate any desired sensation, and they probably have drugs/modifications that can likely relieve and completely inhibit stress, and there is almost certainly better things by then that can keep human hands and minds busy, if such a thing is even still needed. Smoking, vaping, and even chewing gum are all likely obsolete in their era.

caberwikijack

4y↑4

"Don't tell me they don't use money in the 23rd century."

"Well they don't!"

"That suits me, I just bought a boat."

J B

It wont be paid off by the 23rd century?

Ted Sowards

4y↑14

I disliked Picard. I kept saying "this isn't Start Trek!" I loved that the future was so bright that we left smoking, swearing, and alcohol behind us. It made that universe unique! Every other show has all that stuff, be unique. It's like watching an Airbender movie that they only fist fight.

Alyss Mathrin

@Wallace Wallaby I don't think anyone thought those things were no longer 'a thing', but that abusing Alcohol and Smoking in excess had been practically eliminated

Wallace Wallaby

Alcohol was in TNG as well. Picard had a vineyard, so there were some contradictions in what was said in TNG, but I do like the idea of no smoking (of any substance) and no alcohol. I avoid both in my life right now and don't understand the appeal.

Alyss Mathrin

4y↑2

This!! Star Trek was supposed to be the optimistic future, whereas Warhammer (for example) is the dark side of Sci-Fi

hosaku wanderer

Always so interesting to me. Maybe they invented versions of smoking that doesn't harm the body anymore or with such high level of medical technology that they could remove the adverse effects easily. Who knows. Sci fi.

Nelson Cabrera

4y↑4

I literally shouted at the screen "NO! WHY?!" when I saw that character vape.

MrFreeGman

2y↑1

In the late 1980s, it was likely that Roddenberry was afflicted by the first manifestations of cerebral vascular disease and encephalopathy as a result of his longstanding recreational use of legal and illicit drugs, including alcohol, methaqualone, methylphenidate, Dexamyl, and cocaine (which he had used regularly since the production of Star Trek: The Motion Picture). Throughout much of his career, he had routinely used stimulants to work through the night on scripts, especially amphetamines.

takerdust

4y↑26

As a kid, I thought Nog said "When you sprinkle it, it destroys the internal organs".

Michael David

@takerdust 👍🏽

takerdust

4y↑7

@Michael David "when used frequently"

Michael David

4y↑2

@FTG HaloFreek me too. what did he actually say?

FTG HaloFreek

4y↑3

Now I feel like a kid cause that’s what I thought he said 😂

DIEGhostfish

4y↑14

Ferengi laughing at someone being petty and selfish is a little funny. Even if it's the pro-feddy kid.

DIEGhostfish

4y↑1

@BigLBA1 Yep.

C Hearne84

4y↑65

Why hasn't JL apologised for how bad this show is yet……………………….. He's apologised for everything else he's not done. Also apologise for Alex kurtzman taking over Star Trek, it's all your fault JL.

ChonchJohnch

4y↑1

axenledgie now this is boomerposting

baronflyguy

4y↑1

Ha, so true.

axenledgie

4y↑5

""""""""""Sir"""""""""" FLATDICK stewart is an abomination against the Star Trek franchise. After allying with alex KUNTzman, I'm appalled at ever having looked up to Pukehard as a character. I've lost all respect for The Next Generation at this point, since basically all of the main cast on that show have migrated over to KUNTzman's trash like cockroaches.

May as well call it "The Next Desecration"!

Stephen's Site

4y↑1

Yup. Star Trek IV got a lot of mileage out of the "no money" gag...right after both Kirk and Bones tried to hire a ship in Star Trek III. (By the way, you forgot to show the scene of Picard knocking back Aldebaran Whiskey with Scotty, or the family wine with his brother. There's plenty of real drinking in TNG.)

Christoph Rackwitz

4y↑1

they made concessions with alcohol in the show.
they could either stop drinking synthehol (because it's pointless and they didn't come up with substitutes for tobacco), or they could come up with smokable stuff that's not harmful (because it's a substitute like synthehol).

katakisLives

Scotty still preferred the real thing

Alex Janssens

4y↑468

Real trek is a future i want. Kurzman trek is just terrible

Alden Zenko

How the fuck do you suppose we're going to get from point A to point B if people deny reality and bury their heads in the sand?

Shendue

4y↑4

Shendue

@Alex Janssens Or just the Maquis.

Dukster9000

@DJTripleThreat78 EU WEI!

Dukster9000

@DJTripleThreat78 Oy vey!

16 More Replies...

vcrbetamax

4y↑3

I realize Data is fully functional but it’s odd they gave him working lungs to be able to smoke.

AdrianVex

4y↑2

"I do have a functional respiratory system, however its purpose is to maintain thermal control of my internal systems. I am in fact capable of functioning for extended periods in a vacuum." It's his heat sink.

Halcyon

I personally figure it's like, some kind of atmospheric analysier gas tank that he's "breathing" with to act like he's smoking for the sake of blending in or acting human

J MH

4y↑96

The gross focus on ASMR vaping in Picard really annoys me.

PlanetPuce

4y↑1

You’re not down w the vape naysh bro?

Thomas Forster

4y↑4

How much do you wanna bet Jul or someone handed them money under the table for that?

Phil Macdonald

Haha, I literally just finished watching the episode of voyager which the clip at the beginning of this video is from with Paris and the physicists wife. (Great episode btw s01e08) And now I just stumbled upon it here on YouTube only an hour later!

I like the line where Paris thanks tuvok for proving his innocence and tuvok says "If you had been guilty, I assure you I would have pursued the truth just as vigilantly." Good ol' Vulcans 😂

DeLorean4

2y↑1

Not the same kind of smoking, but, in Voyager, there was an episode where the Doctor walks in on Tom's Chevrolet Camaro hologram, scans the car with his tricorder and observes "Medieval safety constraints, internal combustion system producing lethal levels of carbon monoxide. Hmm, I stand corrected. This may be just what you need to get you back to Sickbay."

Space Faring Civilisation

As a general rule before they make more they should make the writers watch past episodes of a series, if they wish to continue, and watch everything they can about the creator’s visions.

Marxist Kiska

4y↑2

An adult: It's up to each individual to help create a better world.
A nihilistic teenager: Some people aren't nice. Burn the whole thing to the ground!

Sara Adrian

I don’t see all of these as extreme inconsistencies. It’s a big universe. I’m sure on some federation planets the use of real tobacco, alcohol, and drugs are rare, and finding support is easy if someone gains a dependency. However people who reject help, or don’t have easy access to it may find themselves more likely to want and use real alcohol or drugs. The federation doesn’t use money, but not everyone can live in a French villa either. People don’t starve or live in poverty (I wouldn’t say Raffi lives in squalor, I’d live there), but some because of inheritance or status may have more than others. Just because nobody starves or is homeless doesn’t mean everyone gets equal everything.

As far as money goes, it’s pretty obvious that outside of the federation there is currency. The Ferengi aren’t going to stop using latium just because the Federation doesn’t in its society for example.

These details just show the federation aren’t homogeneous. It makes sense that some vices won’t be completely phased out entirely. Also makes sense that some folks would swear, it’s just never been shown before. Times change, makes sense the series would change too

Johnny 5

If you haven't seen the movie Thank You For Smoking, I highly recommend you watch it. It'll put a lot of these scenes in a new context.

Diane Brooks

4y↑4

There's so much teenage angst in the new Star Trek...

steve B

4y↑7

I needed to smoke and drink just to get through Picard.

Alden Zenko

That cool, you hate something that Sir Patrick put a lot of effort into and which a lot of fans like. Just so long as you don't jump on a giant boomer bandwagon trying to actually hurt and dehumanize people who like it. Oh wait, too late

Nash Shaffer

4y↑2

When Riker asked Picard about his new crew he said that they have far more baggage than what the Enterprise D officers had. Picard’s new crew and their “vices” (smoking/drinking) reflects that...Picard new crew are “flawed” hero’s

Nash Shaffer

Benjamin Kesler LOL... I must concur :)

Benjamin Kesler

4y↑4

Can we all just move on from this "flawed hero" nonsense? It has been done to death and 99% of writers are terrible at it.

dark gob

1:56 That second cigarette falling out of the pack, clearly a blooper they left in because it didn't disrupt the scene. Good ad lib by the actress, just grabbing it and moving on like a real person would.

MolecularArts

I love these videos contrasting how bad new Trek is compared with old Trek

duncan

Imagine writing a show in 2019 and thinking that showing characters smoking and drinking will make them cool.

Kyle Vernon

4y↑2

There were tons of drinking in the original series and TNG. Picard would always have a glass of wine or whiskey in his hand.

jdslyman

4y↑1

Not to mention Scotty would drink an alien under the table😂 "It is green"

WUZLE

4y↑1

Star Trek used to be about a future you'd want to live in. Picard is about the future being a hellscape that NO ONE wants to live in.

Lynch85

4y↑15

That no drinking rule was gone the moment we saw the Picard vineyard for the first time.

mario pinoli

And a glass of wine a day is good for health

Dandelion Down

@Become upset. Oh, that's the stuff that Scotty found on Gany-room, uh, Gany-mere, -mede.

Bazzok Zwattom

4y↑3

@katakisLives I agree. I think it could come to a point where the large majority of people would not subscribe to those vices. But, some people will still go against the trend.

katakisLives

4y↑2

@Bazzok Zwattom the idea these vices had been totally eliminated is laughable

katakisLives

@NFS just because most don't doesn't mean none do

6 More Replies...

Alagass

4y↑1

Omfg that last scene had me rolling so hard

Kevin Fisher

4y↑1

Whatever happened to "synthahol" in KurtzTrek any way? Did people suddenly enjoy getting hangovers post-TNG? Or is it yet another thing he "forgot" was part of the established lore?

Stewart mcminn

3y↑1

Money and drinking and smoking exists outside starfleet.

Considering the Enterprise was a exploration ship it is a 24/7 job you can't get pissed in 10 forward.
DS9 however was a space station, they often got drunk during off duty at quarks

nt78stonewobble

To be fair... Considering the technological level in star trek it's possible that they could have some sort of genetically manipulated non harmful tobacco, replicate a non harmful one or that treatment of any damage is trivial.

Sideshow Kaz’ Stuff

In Picard it’s still shown as a bad thing. It’s shown as how far someone has been pushed.

Emperor Marcus Aurelius Antoninus Augustus

Old Trek characters: "Well gee, looks there's a significant problem we need to confront; better get on it and find an ethical solution!"
New Trek characters: "Well gee, looks like there's a significant problem; better start drinking and smoking weird shit to numb the pain because everything sucks and life is pointless!"

G. Sergius Fidenas

4y↑1

But how am I supposed to know the characters I am seeing are cool / badass / edgy if they don't smoke, drink, use profanity like a sailor and recur to violence first as their usual MO?

Rob8729

4y↑33

CBS keeps putting people in charge of Star Trek who have never seen Star Trek....it’s like they want to destroy the franchise.

John Willings

All you have to do is look at gene roddenberry's last name then the last name of those that followed to understand what is going on. Same with the Orville... what is the source of that "faustian spirit" in some shows that is missing in others?

Michael Pohoreski

4y↑2

"Seth Trek" aka The Orville is made by fans for fans.
Star Trash: Disaster, Star 'Tard and Star Wreck: Lower Dreck are made by non-fans for non-fans. It is obvious Alex "Klutzman" has no fucking clue about what makes ST:TNG great. *Good Sci-Fi is about exploring the social implications of Technology*

Frank Berry

4y↑2

@Myrddin Emrys That is tragic.

Myrddin Emrys

4y↑2

@Frank Berry and the even sadder thing is that his little sidekick is Roddenberry's son.

Frank Berry

4y↑1

Kurtzman knew enough about Trek to know what would upset the fans. He admitted as much in one of his interviews.

Abu Yusuf Al Amreeki

its utterly mindboggling how it can take you years and hours upon hours of content to expose how kurtzman trek is not real trek and still have years of content left to explore. that is truly telling of how far from star trek they are. and truly sad for real trek fans

Scorpius

4y↑2

when the language came into ST, I was annoyed but fine - but when the smoking was added. that a big nail in the coffin for me.

Awww, he cut off the bit from ST5, when the Romulan said "I suppose that is Klingon for "Hello"". One of the few good scenes from ST5.

SoullessFun

4y↑1

Scotty getting drunk in Relics? Scotty saying he just BOUGHT a boat in Undiscovered Country? Continuity has never EVER been Trek’s strong point.

enginerdy

4y↑1

It doesn't exactly have the same kind of socio-political importance that it once had, now that only 14% of people smoke (down from over 40% in the 60s)

Joe

4y↑3

If it'll make a good video, you could juxtapose "Data's" (Ira Graves') eulogy from "The Schizoid Man", specifically the parts where he talks about love, with Data's final scene in ST:P, just to highlight the ridiculousness of the "love" dialogue.

Also please share a contact for us to send you video ideas!

Brandon Link

The alcohol is fine in some cases because most people, especially in the 24th century, can have a couple drinks without needing to down an entire bottle.

jwbartle

4y↑14

The DS9 clips are cheating because those weren't the actual characters, they were holograms that looked like them.

Alex Jones

4y↑4

@Constitutionalist Libertarian Fair point, although his smoking (played by the unforgetable David Warner (the Cardassian who interrogated Picard "THERE ARE FOUR LIGHTS")) was probably a method to show how much the place had fallen from grace. It was supposed to be a meeting place for the 3 major factions in the Alpha Quadrant, but it failed miserably and even the Ambassadors had given up. So with him smoking it was a visual clue on how far from Federation Standards he had fallen.

Alex Jones

4y↑2

Thats the point - the characters were only seen smoking when in fake surroundings, not in actual day to day life. NuTrek on the other hand has all that, as if it would still be arround in the common day behaviour.

Benjamin Kesler

@Jesse Bogdonoff Yup, with fake holodeck smoke.

AT THE CORE

I haven't watched Picard, but I wanted to watch it when I heard about it.

I can now see why I shouldn't watch it;

It reflects to much of modern day humanity. Relatable, no doubt, but unimaginative of a future based perspective. A show about a species who's advanced this much, should not focus on its connect to a reality already in motion.

They very concept of this perversion is the absolute essence of the spirit of what Star Trek is.

Viva el Betis

4y↑32

Janeway's the only one with an addiction
Cofee adiction

I McMillan

4y↑1

Harry kim has an addiction to anything remotely involving a vagina.

Albert Iulian Harasemiuc

4y↑1

@Alex Jones yes

Alex Jones

4y↑1

@Albert Iulian Harasemiuc are you really complaining about spoilers on a 25 year old show?

Albert Iulian Harasemiuc

@r0bw00d I started watching voyager a few days ago thanks for spoilers:)

r0bw00d

4y↑8

Robert Wafle

4y↑9

I know it doesn't matter but I can't help but think of that Orville episode...

Michael Pohoreski

4y↑1

Seth Trek is made by fans for fans. This hot garbage of Star Trash: Disaster, Star 'Tard: Picard and Star Wreck: Lower Dreck are made by non-fans for non-fans. Alex "Klutzman" is fucking clueless what makes ST:TNG good. *Great Sci-Fi explores the social implications of Technology.*

thetoadberg

4y↑3

Picard's family owns a winery in TNG

Jessica Slater

2y↑1

Gene Roddenberry was a creative mastermind, but his understanding of humanity was somewhat...overly optimistic. The idea that "humans will be too smart to smoke" isn't feasible. There are plenty of brilliant people that smoke, use drugs, and drink alcohol. Hell, Carl Sagan routinely smoked weed. It's just silly to believe that humans will "advance beyond" the consumption of addictive substance when in reality, advancement will simply mean proper treatment of addiction as an illness and better management of recreational use of substances.

Faded Neon

4y↑2

to be fair, the negative effects of smoking should be like nothing to their medical science. so why not smoke? no cancer, and apparently they have something to kick withdraws too. so whyyyy not. what is the downside?

Eric Christmas

So...in all fairness, the holodeck stuff has safety filters on, and humans in the show have regularly wanted to dive into bad habbits from the past 😂

davless152000

It's crazy how star trek tng ds9 Voyager era felt so diffrent and years later it's like star trek became dark and mature I wont be surprised if star trek 4 becomes rated R

Kieran Law

I would love to see a TV show where all of today’s problems vanish and with unlimited energy and thoughtful scientific exploration we are able to peacefully populate the stars…

Dick Marx

4y↑1

For as WOKE as TNG was
There's a whole lot of addictive substance consumption

Paul Patton

4y↑1

The new writers lack the creativity to live up to Gene Roddenberry's vision. All they know is fashionable dystopia.

Robert Johnson

4y↑2

As if I needed more of a reason to shun the reboot Picard.

JessiD618

As much as old Trek is superior art to what we have now, I think it’s only natural the more people thought about it, the more they realized vice and suffering are part of the human condition and not something we can simply evolve or engineer our way out of.

demilung

I'm failing to understand how they made this character giving Picard this critical and harsh speech about his rich and "fine chateu" in an age where humanity literally no longer uses money. Did they re-invent poverty just to make a few cliche characters?

Th3 Be4St

Seeing as picard had his own wine i wouldnt of thought alcohol was bannished. Smoking yes

Dr_Doctor

4y↑58

New Trek is prob the writers self-projecting

Th0ughtf0rce

Not probably. And it was not a sightly projection.

katakisLives

4y↑3

All writing all creation is self projection

Angry vault guy

What made star trek unique was that it showed a very optimistic future for humanity while most sci-fi it a bleak future where war and conflict is constant, while in star trek humanity grew pass things like racism, poverty, war, disease and more also thing like smoking stop being popular they don't even drink real alcohol half the time it's synthetic, i remember TNG in the holodeck Beverly was offered a chewing gum and swallowed the gum immediately this may seem small but it shows how vastly different humans from the 24st century are

BNuts

4y↑3

Could you have added some of the scenes of Bortus and Klyden getting addicted from The Orville ?

Nitpicking Nerd

@The Honorable Reverend Addison Bortion yeah

The Honorable Reverend Addison Bortion

@Nitpicking Nerd So, this is your alt?

Nitpicking Nerd

I thought about it but decided to keep it for a separate video

Lucawits

I like how Gene Roddenberry believed that we as a people would kick smoking, but knew that humans could never stop drinking.

Timothy Dalbeck

Meanwhile the guy drunk and did cocaine.

Wi-Fi TV

Honestly it doesn't surprise me that smoking is rare in star trek, but I feel like drinking would be much more common, since alcohol can be consumed in a safe manner. Then again, things like lung cancer and COPD would probably be an easy fix in the 23rd-25th centuries

Amalvipls

well, the main difference is class
Smoking and drinking in the TNG was to pay homage to detective, casanova or other cinema archetypes, it felt in good taste
Picard had to make it look digusting, depressive, decadent and brutish

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